Check Engine Lights Flashes-The Saga Continues 2/10

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Check Engine Lights Flashes-The Saga Continues 2/10

December 22, 2010, 11:53:44 AM

On the way to work this morning my check engine light came on. I was going up a large hill at 62mph. It comes on for 10 secs or less, the engine looses power, and then all is fine. When it happens, I usually floor it, just to get a little more out of it in case something bad happens, like the car shuts off.

Now this only happens going up hills at similar speeds. And it only happens once a month or so. If I pull codes, there is not any new codes, just the same ones which have been there forever. Is it possible the car isn't storing it? How can I determine which one it is?

I'm at work, shirt and tie job, so I can't be playing around with it at work, but I thought I would throw it one here just to see if anyone has advice.

Check Engine Lights Flashes-The Saga Continues 2/10

Reply #1 – December 22, 2010, 05:32:38 PM

I *think* I read somewhere that an o2 sensor could intermittently fail and cause CEL to come off and on.

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Reply #2 – December 22, 2010, 07:18:40 PM

You sure the car isn't stalling? Usually a check engine light will come on any time the key is on but the engine isn't running. The spinning drivetrain will keep the engine turning even though it's dead and will restart it once things come back alive...

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Reply #3 – December 23, 2010, 08:28:53 AM

Quote from: Thunder Chicken;346568

You sure the car isn't stalling? Usually a check engine light will come on any time the key is on but the engine isn't running. The spinning drivetrain will keep the engine turning even though it's dead and will restart it once things come back alive...

Yeah its not stalling. The car has just shut off before while driving down the road. IT just seems to really stumble and almost act as if the car was real cold and you stepped on it hard, it like "shutters" for those couple of seconds and then all is fine. Car is an 87 t-bird 5.0 with a factory AOD and a factory 3.08 rear(original to the v6 car).

Now where it flashes and goes out, and I ran codes last night, which was 4 starts/trips later, shouldn't the code be in the memory? Therefore does this mean this check engine light coincides with one of the pre-existing codes stored?

If the above statement is true, why doesn't clearing the codes remove any of the codes? If it doesn't flash, shouldn't the code not be present until it does.

Check Engine Lights Flashes-The Saga Continues 2/10

Reply #4 – December 24, 2010, 09:58:39 PM

a check engine light usually means a hard failure. flickering check engine light would be pointing to a hard failure to the oil pump if it happens when running. is this a basic digital cluster with buttstuffog fuel / temp needle?

If i had a check engine light coming on, I would be checking and double checking things out.
Start by cleaning the coolant temp sensor, air charge temp sensor, check the tps voltage, and also put up the codes you have on now.

there are sooooo many things to think of but if your codes are available, post them in this thread.
If you have looked at them and nothing makes sense, then that would be the only time i would suggest shot gunning your approach to troubleshooting.

Perhaps you can set up a couple of monitoring circuits ..as an example...
find a rotary "selector" switch from like radio shack.
you can temporary tap into multiple devices and use your meter to monitor voltage levels.

If i were you, I would start at the ignition switch first.,, too hard to tell right now.

Check Engine Lights Flashes-The Saga Continues 2/10

Reply #5 – January 05, 2011, 11:46:21 AM

So a momentary flickering of the check engine light means a failure in the oil pump? Yes this is a standard gauge cluster with the buttstuffog fuel and temp gauges.

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Reply #6 – January 05, 2011, 01:45:39 PM

I know that when my car had problems with "shuddering" or "bucking" uphills was due to my fuel pump. The in tank fuel pump has a rubber hose between the actual pump and the metal lines for the sending unit. That rubber hose disintegrated over time and had a fair sized hole in it. The car was fine in park, fine on flat roads, but going up hills was not fun. I don't recall watching the check engine light, I was usually busy mashing the throttle in hopes the car didn't stall out! I also don't think that the computer can check to see if the fuel pump is failing in such a manner, so that might explain why you don't have any new codes.

YMMV of course, this is just what happened to me.

Check Engine Lights Flashes-The Saga Continues 2/10

Reply #7 – January 05, 2011, 02:02:04 PM

Quote from: jpc647;348468

So a momentary flickering of the check engine light means a failure in the oil pump? Yes this is a standard gauge cluster with the buttstuffog fuel and temp gauges.

Not necessarily, but it certainly could ..aftermarket gauges can really be your friend

Check Engine Lights Flashes-The Saga Continues 2/10

Reply #8 – January 05, 2011, 03:05:35 PM

I would guess the engine is missing. Ignition or starving for fuel-too lean to ignite properly, or plugs.

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Reply #9 – January 06, 2011, 09:20:05 AM

Quote from: mcb82gt;348479

I would guess the engine is missing. Ignition or starving for fuel-too lean to ignite properly, or plugs.

Plugs, wires, cap, and rotor and brand new. Like from 3 weeks ago. This is interesting. I'll change the fuel filter tonight, I've been meaning to for a while now. I hope it's not a fuel pump. It's too cold out to want to do that now.

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Reply #10 – January 06, 2011, 09:24:54 AM

Quote from: dragon574444;348474

I know that when my car had problems with "shuddering" or "bucking" uphills was due to my fuel pump. The in tank fuel pump has a rubber hose between the actual pump and the metal lines for the sending unit. That rubber hose disintegrated over time and had a fair sized hole in it. The car was fine in park, fine on flat roads, but going up hills was not fun. I don't recall watching the check engine light, I was usually busy mashing the throttle in hopes the car didn't stall out! I also don't think that the computer can check to see if the fuel pump is failing in such a manner, so that might explain why you don't have any new codes.

YMMV of course, this is just what happened to me.

Did the engine light flicker, or stay one? Just curious. Fast blinks or slow ones?

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Reply #11 – January 06, 2011, 10:32:09 AM

It could be the oil pressure sending unit. I had one go intermittent on me and then it finally died. They are cheap and easy to replace.

You should be able to clear all of the stored codes in the EEC with the hand held code reader. If you clear them and they show back up then you need to fix them. From what I remember the techs at Ford had to fix the codes as they came up as other codes could be hidden behind it. py way of describing it but if you did not clear one round of codes then the EEC may not be able to alert you to additional codes being covered up by the first one. Its been a while since I have dealt with the older generation of the EEC's.

Darren

Check Engine Lights Flashes-The Saga Continues 2/10

Reply #12 – January 06, 2011, 12:54:02 PM

Quote from: Aerocoupe;348568

It could be the oil pressure sending unit. I had one go intermittent on me and then it finally died. They are cheap and easy to replace.

You should be able to clear all of the stored codes in the EEC with the hand held code reader. If you clear them and they show back up then you need to fix them. From what I remember the techs at Ford had to fix the codes as they came up as other codes could be hidden behind it. py way of describing it but if you did not clear one round of codes then the EEC may not be able to alert you to additional codes being covered up by the first one. Its been a while since I have dealt with the older generation of the EEC's.

Darren

Wouldn't that make the oil pressure idiot light come on, and not the check engine lights?

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Reply #13 – January 06, 2011, 02:29:16 PM

If that was the case (I am pretty sure you are correct) then I would suspect the oil pump failing would do the same thing. I was just throwing it out there as it was a cheap and easy fix on my car when it had the old TB injected 302.

Darren

Check Engine Lights Flashes-The Saga Continues 2/10

Reply #14 – January 06, 2011, 03:54:32 PM

Quote from: jpc647;346691

Yeah its not stalling. The car has just shut off before while driving down the road. IT just seems to really stumble and almost act as if the car was real cold and you stepped on it hard, it like "shutters" for those couple of seconds and then all is fine. Car is an 87 t-bird 5.0 with a factory AOD and a factory 3.08 rear(original to the v6 car).

Now where it flashes and goes out, and I ran codes last night, which was 4 starts/trips later, shouldn't the code be in the memory? Therefore does this mean this check engine light coincides with one of the pre-existing codes stored?

If the above statement is true, why doesn't clearing the codes remove any of the codes? If it doesn't flash, shouldn't the code not be present until it does.

Lets try to clear up some of this code mystery.
The codes come in three categories. The meaning of some codes change depending on which category it is in.
KOEO gives two categories of codes:
1. On demand codes. These read out first. They are the results of the self tests that run when you "pull codes". They are "faults" present at the time of testing. They are not stored in the KAM(Keep Alive Memory). The only way to get rid of them is to fix the problem.
2. Memory (or continuous) codes. These read out second, after a separator pulse or a 10 on the code reader. These are "faults" collected and stored during drive cycles.
These can be reset by disconnecting the jumper from the self test connector pig tail wire or disconnecting the pig tail wire from the code reader while the codes are reading out.
Rerun the KOEO to verify they cleared.
3. KOER codes.

What codes do you have and what category are they in?