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Topic: 5.0 so running rich (help!!!!!) (Read 10625 times) previous topic - next topic

5.0 so running rich (help!!!!!)

Reply #60 –
34, bad egr. ignore this for now.
85 can op failure? No idea
10 doesn't show
18 spout input error. loss of spark
22 map/baro sensor out of range. id start by replacing or checking the map sensor.

21 ect out of test range.
34 egr again. ignore for now.

Map sensor is the biggest worry. replacing the dist might have helped your loss of spark. test or replace your map sensor and see what happends.
Quote from: jcassity
I honestly dont think you could exceed the cost of a new car buy installing new *stock* parts everywhere in your coug our tbird. Its just plain impossible. You could revamp the entire drivetrain/engine/suspenstion and still come out ahead.
Hooligans! 
1988 Crown Vic wagon. 120K California car. Wifes grocery getter. (junked)
1987 Ford Thunderbird LX. 5.0. s.o., sn-95 t-5 and an f-150 clutch. Driven daily and going strong.
1986 cougar.
lilsammywasapunkrocker@yahoo.com

5.0 so running rich (help!!!!!)

Reply #61 –
85 - CANP Circuit Failure
34 - EGR Valve Position/Pressure Feedback EGR Voltage Above Closed Limit
22 - Manifold Absolute Pressure/Barometric Pressure Sensor Out Of Self Test Range
21 - Engine Coolant Temperature (ECT) Sensor Out Of Self Test Range
18 - Loss Of Ignition Diagnostic Module Input To PCM/SPOUT Circuit Grounded
10 & 8 do not exist in EEC-IV that I am aware of.

The 21 is your biggest issue.  CanP is irrelevant for right now.  Put that at the bottom of the list.  The MAP code did not show while running so I would bet it's stored in continuous memory....It WILL put the ECU into FMEM (limp) mode though.... As will the code 34.  The code 34 on it's own will cause the ECU to plug in a "safe" value for EGR position and increase fuel a little bit.  Plenty of Fox Mustang guys report running around with no EGR and have zero issue.....
Do the KOER test again to make sure that 8 isn't in fact a repeat of 18.  That points to a possible faulty tach signal.  Test the ECT circuit.  Start with the sensor.  It's easiest to check and most likely your culprit.  The sensor is a thermistor that changes resistance as coolant temp. changes.

-- 05 Mustang GT-Whipplecharged !!
--87 5.0 Trick Flow Heads & Intake - Custom Cam - Many other goodies...3100Lbs...Low12's!

5.0 so running rich (help!!!!!)

Reply #62 –
X
So this is nothing to worrier bout the car runs great with it unplugged an dies as soon as u plug it back in any ideas an thanks for the help with the codes would say I'll work on it today but its my sons 2nd birthday no work today
First car I owned an wish I wasnt so Young a Dumb
86-TBird 5.0 SO Pretty much original
GOT TO LOVE A FOUR EYE
81-F250- 7.5 460
73- closed camber heads w/ studs
Bored 30 over
528 lift voodoo can
1.73 roller rockers
PLAY TRUCK
11' KIA SORENTO (WIFES CAR)
96' SL2 SATREN 250000+ MILES DD

5.0 so running rich (help!!!!!)

Reply #63 –
Do the Birds and Cougars have the salt and pepper shakers at the rear of the intake where the main EEC harness connects to the injector harness?  It sounds like all of these issues would be tied up in those connectors on my Coupe.  I had to tear those connectors apart and clean each connector by pulling it out of the plug.  Put it all back together with some dielectric grease and all the codes but the EGR went away which is due to me not running one.

Darren

83 351W TKO'd T-Bird on the bottle


93 331 Mustang Coupe - 368 rwhp

5.0 so running rich (help!!!!!)

Reply #64 –
That's no good....  What's your base timing at with the spout connector removed?  Aerocoupe, the sefi 5.0 has the salt & paper shakers.  It's worth a shot giving them a once over.... I'd verify correct timing, do the shakers, and re-check codes after....
-- 05 Mustang GT-Whipplecharged !!
--87 5.0 Trick Flow Heads & Intake - Custom Cam - Many other goodies...3100Lbs...Low12's!

5.0 so running rich (help!!!!!)

Reply #65 –
Quote from: V8Demon;431374
That's no good....  What's your base timing at with the spout connector removed?  Aerocoupe, the sefi 5.0 has the salt & paper shakers.  It's worth a shot giving them a once over.... I'd verify correct timing, do the shakers, and re-check codes after....

Yeah timing could be waaay off......
88 Thunderbird LX: 306, Edelbrock Performer heads, Comp 266HR cam, Edelbrock Performer RPM intake, bunch of other stuff.

5.0 so running rich (help!!!!!)

Reply #66 –
The 10 is the separator between on demand and memory codes for KOEO.
He is using a code reader.

5.0 so running rich (help!!!!!)

Reply #67 –
Don't forget, the spout turns off computer controlled ignition advanced. this also points to tfi/pip sensor issues.

Ect out of self test range could mean the car wasn't fully up to  operating temps.

My guess is still the same I had before. Map sensor. This should never show up in codes, cm or not.

In my opinion, the loss of spark, timing, and whatever is stopping it from running with spout out needs looked at first. my tbird runs fine right now with the egr not even plugged in, not even under the hood. I never even blocked off the vac line.
Quote from: jcassity
I honestly dont think you could exceed the cost of a new car buy installing new *stock* parts everywhere in your coug our tbird. Its just plain impossible. You could revamp the entire drivetrain/engine/suspenstion and still come out ahead.
Hooligans! 
1988 Crown Vic wagon. 120K California car. Wifes grocery getter. (junked)
1987 Ford Thunderbird LX. 5.0. s.o., sn-95 t-5 and an f-150 clutch. Driven daily and going strong.
1986 cougar.
lilsammywasapunkrocker@yahoo.com

5.0 so running rich (help!!!!!)

Reply #68 –
I'm using a code reader an I think 10 I think is cylinder one an I'll try to work on it this week sometime (I hope)
First car I owned an wish I wasnt so Young a Dumb
86-TBird 5.0 SO Pretty much original
GOT TO LOVE A FOUR EYE
81-F250- 7.5 460
73- closed camber heads w/ studs
Bored 30 over
528 lift voodoo can
1.73 roller rockers
PLAY TRUCK
11' KIA SORENTO (WIFES CAR)
96' SL2 SATREN 250000+ MILES DD

5.0 so running rich (help!!!!!)

Reply #69 –
Quote
Ect out of self test range could mean the car wasn't fully up to operating temps.

Didn't even think of that.  Second nature for me is to give the car a 10 minute run first.

Quote
The 10 is the separator between on demand and memory codes for KOEO.

Access to a Snap-on makes me forget.....I'll try not to again.  ;)

Quote from: thunderjet302;431380
Yeah timing could be waaay off......

I'm thinking this may be more of a PIP issue.....Worst case ECM.
-- 05 Mustang GT-Whipplecharged !!
--87 5.0 Trick Flow Heads & Intake - Custom Cam - Many other goodies...3100Lbs...Low12's!

5.0 so running rich (help!!!!!)

Reply #70 –
It very well could be a PIP issue. He did mess with it.
88 Thunderbird LX: 306, Edelbrock Performer heads, Comp 266HR cam, Edelbrock Performer RPM intake, bunch of other stuff.

5.0 so running rich (help!!!!!)

Reply #71 –
If it was ecm its likely the sigrtn circuit would have fried. that would lose 90% of the sensors to the engine and likely wouldn't run at all with the spout out.

My opinion, verify positive timing setup, then verify spark/pip function. a new loaded dist was about $35 last time I bought one. swap in a good .fi module, clear codes and see what pops up. shouldn't take more then an hour in my opinion.

Overall, it should be a pretty simple fix as long as your able to trouble shoot components easily. its easy to get overwhelmed and over think things.
Quote from: jcassity
I honestly dont think you could exceed the cost of a new car buy installing new *stock* parts everywhere in your coug our tbird. Its just plain impossible. You could revamp the entire drivetrain/engine/suspenstion and still come out ahead.
Hooligans! 
1988 Crown Vic wagon. 120K California car. Wifes grocery getter. (junked)
1987 Ford Thunderbird LX. 5.0. s.o., sn-95 t-5 and an f-150 clutch. Driven daily and going strong.
1986 cougar.
lilsammywasapunkrocker@yahoo.com

5.0 so running rich (help!!!!!)

Reply #72 –
Here is a diy pip/tfi testing procedure. make sure your timing is set right and lets get ya back on the road.

 http://351winsor.com/joel/Ignition_Systems/tfi2.html
Quote from: jcassity
I honestly dont think you could exceed the cost of a new car buy installing new *stock* parts everywhere in your coug our tbird. Its just plain impossible. You could revamp the entire drivetrain/engine/suspenstion and still come out ahead.
Hooligans! 
1988 Crown Vic wagon. 120K California car. Wifes grocery getter. (junked)
1987 Ford Thunderbird LX. 5.0. s.o., sn-95 t-5 and an f-150 clutch. Driven daily and going strong.
1986 cougar.
lilsammywasapunkrocker@yahoo.com

5.0 so running rich (help!!!!!)

Reply #73 –
Here is a diy pip/tfi testing procedure. make sure your timing is set right and lets get ya back on the road.

 http://351winsor.com/joel/Ignition_Systems/tfi2.html
Quote from: jcassity
I honestly dont think you could exceed the cost of a new car buy installing new *stock* parts everywhere in your coug our tbird. Its just plain impossible. You could revamp the entire drivetrain/engine/suspenstion and still come out ahead.
Hooligans! 
1988 Crown Vic wagon. 120K California car. Wifes grocery getter. (junked)
1987 Ford Thunderbird LX. 5.0. s.o., sn-95 t-5 and an f-150 clutch. Driven daily and going strong.
1986 cougar.
lilsammywasapunkrocker@yahoo.com

5.0 so running rich (help!!!!!)

Reply #74 –
Sorry its been a few days I haven't had a whole lot of time lately with working an a 2 year old at home but as soon as I get a chance I'm planning on working on the car an I'll get back with y'all an thanks again for everyone's advice an wonderful help I can't thank everyone enough
First car I owned an wish I wasnt so Young a Dumb
86-TBird 5.0 SO Pretty much original
GOT TO LOVE A FOUR EYE
81-F250- 7.5 460
73- closed camber heads w/ studs
Bored 30 over
528 lift voodoo can
1.73 roller rockers
PLAY TRUCK
11' KIA SORENTO (WIFES CAR)
96' SL2 SATREN 250000+ MILES DD