Why GM went bankrupt

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Why GM went bankrupt

Reply #15 – September 25, 2012, 06:25:46 AM

All Ford did was swap the order of cylinders 5 and 3 and cylinders 4 and 7 to get the new firing order. Also, don't forget that Ford numbers its cylinders differently than Chevy. A Ford has 1-2-3-4 on the right bank and 5-6-7-8 on the left side. Chevy is 1-3-5-7 on the left and 2-4-6-8 on the right If you simply renumber cylinder locations of the older Ford engines as if they were Chevys, you'll discover that the firing order is, in fact, identical to GM style. Further, if you take the 351 and late-5.0L Ford firing order and renumber the cylinders like a Chevy, the firing order is 1-8-7-2-6-5-4-3. That's the same as the Chevy Gen III and IV LS-series V-8s.

Now i am DUN!!! 302 and as i depart

Why GM went bankrupt

Reply #16 – September 25, 2012, 08:48:21 AM

I think the original point of the thread has been sidetracked. It really matters not whether the LS engines are good, great or suck eggs, if GM can't or won't make decisions, overall that keep them in business without tapping the taxpayers pockets. Like GM and Chrysler, Ford has made decisions that have been, shall we say questionable, the latest attempt to make a Thunderbird come to mind, though it can't go without notice that Ford managed to shed debt, cut losses and avoid tapping the taxpayers pockets to stay in business. They will be rewarded for their efforts, as they should be. Maybe some day Ford will purchase GM for a song or at the very least hire those brilliant engineers that have contributed to the LS engines and perhaps other overlooked areas of superior engineering, bolstering their talent pool and providing the consumer with the best of the best...again, as it should be.

Why GM went bankrupt

Reply #17 – September 25, 2012, 05:51:40 PM

Everyone is just bothered by the fact that ls engines can make some serious steam, stock. I don't get all the hate the ls swappers get on this forum. A cool fast car is just that. Having an almost identical weight, size, headers, boltpattern and layout should make it a very popular swap.

Its just too bad everyone on here is so close minded.

Why GM went bankrupt

Reply #18 – September 26, 2012, 08:18:50 AM

I wouldnt call it close minded, more like personal preference. We're all driving Fox T-bird/Cougar's for heavens sake, that alone makes us a pretty open minded bunch. There's nothing wrong with preferring Ford powerplants in Ford vehicles. I really like the LS series engines, heck I even drive a Chevy Z71 w/5.3 daily but I get tired of seeing SBC's and LS motors swapped into EVERYTHING. Look on ebay at old hotrods, I don't care what brand of car it is chances are it has a freakin' 350/350 swapped in.

Personally, there's nothing more refreshing than seeing a old Ford hot rod with a flathead or SBF instead of a 350/350 combo (can we say boring?). The LS is the new 350/350 combo.

Why GM went bankrupt

Reply #19 – September 26, 2012, 09:22:10 AM

Looking at the photo Carm posted, it looks like they borrowed the wheel covers from the Bonneville from a few years ago. The van is ugly, for sure.

I wince every time I see a new Equinox. It's so overcooked it's nearly cartoonish.

Why GM went bankrupt

Reply #20 – September 26, 2012, 12:01:21 PM

I don't hate GM's LS engine. It DOES make great power for it's size and weight.
I DO hate seeing a reference to one by the same person nearly everytime he posts, however.

With that said, all the manufacturers have to trim costs to stay solvent...unfortunately, for GM, the result was a hideous concoction like the first post shows...

Why GM went bankrupt

Reply #21 – September 26, 2012, 01:18:52 PM

Personally, I hope it's that American's (middle class) are finally learning to live within their means. Last time I bought a new car was in 1986 (I wish it were my Cougar) but it wasn't. People spend $40,000 for a car and then by the time it's paid for it, it is worth little to nothing. Most people can't work on the new cars, mainly because they are pretty much computers on wheels and need expensive equipment and training. I believe that is why people are starting to have more respect for the cars of yesterday. Registration, insurance, maintenance, is far less, not to mention no car payment. They say most divorces in this country are over money. Where I worked for about half my life, I watched people move up the ladder of success. They would work 60+ hours a week for a raise or a promotion, never having the time to enjoy their toys. Sorta like Tom's quote: "To impress people I don't know". There was always the cars parked away from all the other, because they were in fear of having their baby scratched or touched. I even used to ask some of my friends if their family had a picture of them so they would remember what they looked like when they finally walked in the door. I've heard of so many of them dropping dead only month's after retiring because they didn't know what to do with themselves. At 65+ they were trying to find a hobby. When I had my new Camero IROC back in "86", I realized that I drove it 30 miles a day to and from work to let it sit in the sun for 8.5 hours, then groceries, gas station, stores and back home. Money... you can be it's master.... or it's slave.

Why GM went bankrupt

Reply #22 – September 26, 2012, 01:56:22 PM

^ One of the most intelligent posts I have read in quite a while!

Why GM went bankrupt

Reply #23 – September 26, 2012, 07:12:54 PM

For real Tom...this IS a board for products of the Ford Motor Company. I for one don't waste my time chastising people like you for doing what you do, in my opinion, you let it go because "who the hell cares". But you should seriously not be surprised at all to receive backlash. As Larry The Cable Guy once said, "why don't I go to a trailer park with a bullhorn and start yelling 'walmart sucks!!'"

Also, relevant to this actual discussion.....one stellar engine, stellar as it may be, does not a car company make. Does not a successful business make. I'd say they're dealing with increasing CAFE requirements well, what with the Cruze, Sonic, Aveo, Cobalt, pretty much the same little car as far as I'm concerned, but you make more models with better efficiency, you pad your average. As opposed to somehow making trucks and Shelby Mustangs get 30+ MPG, or cease their production.

Third, yes 86cougar awesome post. Just had to say that. lol

FOURTH...putting an LS or whatever the hell the "frontrunner" that everyones-doing-cause-its-cheap-and-fast, is a cop-out in mine eyes. A cheap easy way out. If you wanna hoon for pennies, go ahead. Just don't expect anyone to be impressed with the overall package. I don't even like seeing '32 Fords with 350/THM350/Mustang II front/blah blah blah.

What are we talking about here, to clarify the argument? An 18-year-old kid's budget hot-rod rusted/faded/clunky whatever that just needs to be fast and loud and raise hell on a kid's income? Sure, pop the hood and see an LS or an LT1 gotten for "500 bucks man the camaro was wrecked and they just wanted everything gone"

Or

A cleanly and meticulously restored vehicle, that was 100% complete, with it's perhaps goofy but period correct proprietary digital dash and ECM and MPG calculator and all that good stuff...that won't work with a Brand X random motor swap. "But I wanted it to MOVE too". So you spent all this time and money on the restoration....but you cheaped out on the giddy-up. I'm always disappointed when I see this. A real quality well-done badass-looking creative vehicle deserves a drivetrain with the same attributes. Put a Nissan SR20 in it and boost the shiznit out of it. Keep the exhaust quiet, don't open the hood alot, see how long you can keep the secret. Build up a Dodge 440 and have someone custom fab an original 383 COMMANDO air cleaner to fit the two fours that feed it instead of lopping two of those cheesy triangle Edelbrock filters on 'em. No puppies engine in an American car! No Pentastar in a Mustang! But it's unusual and it runs 12's. Strong arguments on both sides of the fence, hard to call it totally right OR totally wrong....

Why GM went bankrupt

Reply #24 – September 26, 2012, 07:21:28 PM

There's a common term that quickly and accurately describes our feelings on the subject: Swap. Pretty much eliminates the need for explanation.

Why GM went bankrupt

Reply #25 – September 26, 2012, 07:34:18 PM

I DO hate seeing a reference to one by the same person nearly everytime he posts

Not to worry i am moving on. All i was doing was making a little joke and it seems like you blew it out of proportion. I equally work on and own many fords and Chevys. As i thought i was a big help with my experience you sounded off about how many Chevy sites i was thrown off. Which by the way is laughable as i am only on one and seldom post. I share my experience as i like to help others. So be it as it may i will pass and let you take over. Just do me a favor and control your temper. It is not my fault the LS engines make so much HP with so little effort. By the way last time i looked an engine is an air pump and no matter who builds said units they all work the same. Only difference is chevys work BETTER that is not my fault. With that i know it is a ford site and i appoligize. But i share things with you guys that i can take to my grave. But that is not ME. Passing on experience and knowledge is something special. So i will pass and let you answer all the ills and repair procedures as well as posting you vast knowledge on the forum with other vehicles i know you are an expert on. Thanks Tom!!!

Why GM went bankrupt

Reply #26 – September 26, 2012, 07:46:59 PM

this is actually kinda odd, to be so harsh on other engines in a serious manner. we all joke around and bust balls but this is a little too serious. Wrenching is wrenching no matter what car you got problems with.

if you happen to be a family member here that has a couple birds or a coug, and it so happens you have problems with your "other" car, we still always try to help.

Why GM went bankrupt

Reply #27 – September 26, 2012, 07:52:37 PM

@Zonda, I don't like the whole unusual engine from XXX manufacturer in XXX othe manufacturer's car either. Want a creative swap idea? here's one. TC with a 2.3L 16v duratec ranger engine, compression drop, T5 (or something similar) , turbo, Air to air, etc. Keeps it in the family, keeps the right to bear it's own name. Now that's an unusual swap. Don't care what the difficulties are, make it work, then lift your hood and brag about overcoming them. I've got a Mark VIII engine under my bench I might just stuff in my bird someday, who knows.

Why GM went bankrupt

Reply #28 – September 26, 2012, 08:46:51 PM

Props to Chevy for their new Silverado ad though. shiznit's hilarious. In a good way.

Why GM went bankrupt

Reply #29 – September 26, 2012, 08:51:53 PM

Foe that is my point exactly, I go to all the local car shows including the big ones. people like my stuff because it is unique. If i see another 5.0 mustang or another CHEVELLE they bore me as do other cars like BIG BLOCK CHEVELLE'S i am going to PUKE. They are a dime a dozen even though i own one myself. They just dont do it for me. I like things like my LS powered 6 speeder STANG DROP. At shows i pop the hood and tuns of people flock by it. I also like Flat heads. Nothing gets my attention more than a traditional TUB FLATTIE !! That is just me. But going to shows always is the same chromed out cars polished and proper stockers and the ones that are 100% stock and 100% resto. Other than that i like people to flock around the cars we build and fascinate them with transplanted this or that. Other than that i am a chevy guy and that is that. But some might say my FORDS are awsum as you have seen some of my toys. As for posting chevy info on a Ford site you are correct. Now if only ford could get an engine to BREATHE we would not be having this conversation. Other than the new engine offered by THE BLUE OVAL!!! Thanks for listening. Just to show you i am flexible here is my HONDA!!! You see i cant let the RICERS get an edge on me. So when they complain about my V8 Cars i show them i can build ricers as well. Once again an engine is an air pump. The more air it pumps the more HP IT MAKES!!!