My 85 TBird - Page 14

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Re: My 85 TBird

Reply #195 – January 06, 2020, 11:22:29 PM

With the help of my brother and a couple of forklifts was able to give the bird some legs tonight. A rotisserie would be nice but this will have to do.

Re: My 85 TBird

Reply #196 – January 07, 2020, 06:49:06 AM

Oof! That is messy overhead work.

Re: My 85 TBird

Reply #197 – January 07, 2020, 11:10:12 PM

Quote from: Chuck W – on January 07, 2020, 06:49:06 AM

Oof! That is messy overhead work.

Oof Indeed! Did some power washing this evening. My attempt at staying dry was futile, but it cleaned up pretty good. Planning on some spot sand blasting and refinishing before undercoating. Might get started on that this weekend.

Re: My 85 TBird

Reply #198 – January 08, 2020, 07:56:37 AM

Before you get crazy on the undercoating I would suggest that you tie the rear of the front subframe into the subframe connector. This is how my Global West units are which those look very similar to. Believe it was just angle iron 1/8" thick and the width was what was close to the width of the subframes by about 4" long.

https://www.foxtbirdcougarforums.com/index.php?action=dlattach;sa=tmpattach;attach=post_tmp_1511_998bcc970ca2d1be625b73b9033cbaf2;topic=33763

Re: My 85 TBird

Reply #199 – January 08, 2020, 12:51:53 PM

Quote from: Aerocoupe – on January 08, 2020, 07:56:37 AM

Before you get crazy on the undercoating I would suggest that you tie the rear of the front subframe into the subframe connector. This is how my Global West units are which those look very similar to. Believe it was just angle iron 1/8" thick and the width was what was close to the width of the subframes by about 4" long.

https://www.foxtbirdcougarforums.com/index.php?action=dlattach;sa=tmpattach;attach=post_tmp_1511_998bcc970ca2d1be625b73b9033cbaf2;topic=33763

Thanks for the heads up on this. I was using your photos back when I built those, it’s been so long I don’t know if I forgot to add them or if I even noticed they were there.

Re: My 85 TBird

Reply #200 – January 08, 2020, 04:51:01 PM

You bet. My thinking is it just keeps the subframe connector from deflecting thus stiffening the car a little more by tying it to the rear of the front subframe.

Did you give any thought to putting in upper subframes like the ones Griggs Racing has? I have them in both my Fox body cars and that is all the black paint you see on the bottom of the floor pan along the front subframe and around the bulk heads of the rear subframes from the welding burning the paint off. I have the drawings for those as well.

Re: My 85 TBird

Reply #201 – January 09, 2020, 01:02:28 AM

I have considered them, I think I even messaged you a time or two about them. You may have sent me the plans, I’ll have to check my shop emails. How bad am I going to regret not having them? Did you have the global west connectors before the Griggs, if so how noticeable was the difference?

Re: My 85 TBird

Reply #202 – January 09, 2020, 10:47:14 AM

The difference is huge. I had the Global West Units in my car for several years before I added the uppers. Added the uppers and ran the car with them for a couple of years. The car is so stiff chassis wise you can jack the car up on the driver front corner and pick that tire up along with the passenger front and the driver rear and the doors will open and close. For reference it did not feel like the car got any stiffer with the welded in six point cage. Realize I also have the torque boxes welded up and tied into the rear bulk head with additional plate. Saw this in an old MM&FF magazine article years ago and did it. I think I have that article scanned and can send that to you.

On a side note the ride improved with the subframe connectors installed.

Re: My 85 TBird

Reply #203 – January 09, 2020, 11:29:04 PM

Quote from: Aerocoupe – on January 09, 2020, 10:47:14 AM

The difference is huge. I had the Global West Units in my car for several years before I added the uppers. Added the uppers and ran the car with them for a couple of years. The car is so stiff chassis wise you can jack the car up on the driver front corner and pick that tire up along with the passenger front and the driver rear and the doors will open and close. For reference it did not feel like the car got any stiffer with the welded in six point cage. Realize I also have the torque boxes welded up and tied into the rear bulk head with additional plate. Saw this in an old MM&FF magazine article years ago and did it. I think I have that article scanned and can send that to you.

On a side note the ride improved with the subframe connectors installed.

I figured as much. Back in the spring of 2018 you sent me the info on those. I’d like to take a look at that other article, I’ll send you an email if it’s the same as it was when you sent the other info.

I kept talking myself out of installing them because I didn’t want to cut up the floor, but with everything else I’ve had to cut up I really don’t know why. I either measured from the wrong spot or they are wrong for the 85. Should have been an inch shorter.

Re: My 85 TBird

Reply #204 – January 10, 2020, 07:19:20 PM

Quote from: Aerocoupe – on January 08, 2020, 04:51:01 PM

You bet. My thinking is it just keeps the subframe connector from deflecting thus stiffening the car a little more by tying it to the rear of the front subframe.

Did you give any thought to putting in upper subframes like the ones Griggs Racing has? I have them in both my Fox body cars and that is all the black paint you see on the bottom of the floor pan along the front subframe and around the bulk heads of the rear subframes from the welding burning the paint off. I have the drawings for those as well.

With the uppers installed, is it still possible to retain fully functioning power seats?

Re: My 85 TBird

Reply #205 – January 10, 2020, 08:50:39 PM

I would say it would be tight to a no go but I’m not sure where things hang down and where on a power seat.

Grigg’s website does say that on ‘94+ street driven Mustangs you will have to run a manual seat track on the driver side or modify the upper subframe tube to clear the power track. Might suggest the Fox style will clear it. I do know the lower seat frame just about touches the upper subframe tube when all the way back with the seat track bolted to the rear seat of holes on the lower seat frame of a Fox Mustang seat on a manual 83 Bird seat track.

Re: My 85 TBird

Reply #206 – January 10, 2020, 10:01:57 PM

Thanks.
Will probably just have to bolt my seat back in, put some power to it and do some measuring to see how much clearance there and see what is possible. I have a friend who is an amazing fabricator and I've always considered doing proper "through the floor" sub frame connectors and with the interior currently gutted, now is the time.

Re: My 85 TBird

Reply #207 – January 11, 2020, 05:36:53 PM

So I looked through all my (electronic and physical copies) and cannot locate that article in MM&FF where they welded up the torque boxes. I followed the article on welding them up on my Bird but for the Coupe I just welded everything up that was a seam. The Coupe was welded up back in 2000 has seen waaaay more torture than the Bird ever has and to this day zero issues.

I would just weld up everything where the parts were spot welded together and if I would have know these existed I would have put them on my Coupe:

https://www.ebay.com/i/191676321000?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-0&mkcid=2&itemid=191676321000&targetid=474173633709&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=1024240&poi=&campaignid=6469750549&mkgroupid=79220335322&rlsatarget=pla-474173633709&abcId=1141176&merchantid=6296724&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIuNm3_s385gIVs41bCh2tTAbQEAQYBCABEgKi7PD_BwE

Re: My 85 TBird

Reply #208 – January 11, 2020, 11:47:04 PM

Quote from: Aerocoupe – on January 11, 2020, 05:36:53 PM

So I looked through all my (electronic and physical copies) and cannot locate that article in MM&FF where they welded up the torque boxes. I followed the article on welding them up on my Bird but for the Coupe I just welded everything up that was a seam. The Coupe was welded up back in 2000 has seen waaaay more torture than the Bird ever has and to this day zero issues.

I would just weld up everything where the parts were spot welded together and if I would have know these existed I would have put them on my Coupe:

https://www.ebay.com/i/191676321000?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-0&mkcid=2&itemid=191676321000&targetid=474173633709&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=1024240&poi=&campaignid=6469750549&mkgroupid=79220335322&rlsatarget=pla-474173633709&abcId=1141176&merchantid=6296724&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIuNm3_s385gIVs41bCh2tTAbQEAQYBCABEgKi7PD_BwE

Thanks for looking. I think I remember reading somewhere from Jack Hidley that if you keep the correct RUCA in place there was no need for all that welding and reinforcement back there. Most A/M RUCA don’t flex like the stocks and end up pulling the body apart. So not sure what I’m going to do there yet.

Got started on the upper subframe connectors this evening. I remember another reason I kept talking myself out of installing them, welding on this bird is a pain in the ass.

Re: My 85 TBird

Reply #209 – January 12, 2020, 11:44:27 AM

So Jack is a very smart guy but I’m running a full MM setup with panhard bar and torque arm in my Coupe and do you think any of it is bolted in? The answer is no sir. It literally takes an hour per side to weld up the torque boxes. The USF and LSF connectors do nothing to strengthen these areas. With the stiffening of the chassis more power will he directed to the place of least strength so my suggestion would be to weld ‘em up and then not have to deal with it later. Good insurance if you ask me.

The uppers look great man!! Keep pushing through as they are so worth it.