4 to 5 lug swap

Topic: 4 to 5 lug swap (Read 21762 times) previous topic - next topic

4 to 5 lug swap

Reply #45 – March 05, 2015, 03:51:58 PM

So I'm looking at getting a 99 mustang gt vert with 17" cobra rims that's in rough shape can I use the rear axle, front spindles and brakes and wheels on my 87 5.0 tbird? I see a bunch of people recommending the 94-98 spindles but I didn't see anything about the 99+

4 to 5 lug swap

Reply #46 – March 05, 2015, 04:03:36 PM

The axles are longer, 99 and up. I'd source some '98-94 axles, myself.

Wheels will be fine, and the spindles will likely need a bump steer kit as the '96+ spindles have raised tie rod mounts.

I'd also suggest '94-'95 spindles for stock height cars, and '96 and up if you're lowering it, or it already is.

Make sure you use those sweet dual piston PBR calipers that are on it, too. Order new flex hoses for a '99 Mustang, and you'll need a Weatherhead fitting #7828, available at most any auto parts store.

I've done the PBR swap, it's easy, uses stock SN95 rotors, but you'll need to grind off a wee bit on the calipers, unless you use the '99 calipers, in which case they're already clearanced.

4 to 5 lug swap

Reply #47 – March 05, 2015, 09:18:55 PM

Chrome,
95 GT MC = 15/16" piston
93 Cobra or 85 Towncar MC = 1" piston

I had a 95 GT MC on my Coupe with the SN95 brakes and it is still on the car with the Cobra brakes. The Bird has a 95 GT MC with full Cobra brakes and neither have ever had a soft pedal except when I had a little air in the lines on the Coupe. Maybe you have air in the lines? I use a power bleeder to get the air out of the lines and I can bleed the system with no help. I had to do this as the Coupe has the ABS from the 95 GT on it and this is the only way to get all the air out of the system. This is the power bleeder I use:

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/mvp-0107

teal9550,
The spindles off the 99-04 Mustangs are the same as the 96-98 spindles geometry wise but the 99-04 have the clearance to run the 99+ PBR dual piston calipers. The 99+ rear ends are physically different than the 86-93 and 94-98 rear ends in both housing length and axle length. The 94-98 rear ends are a bolt in to the Birds and Cougars axle to axle as far as I know so I tend to recommend that setup for those moving to five lug and disc brakes.

You can use the all of the parts off the front of the '99 Vert GT for your five lug swap. From what I have read the rear brakes (axle s, caliper brackets, caliper, pads, and rotors) are all the same from 94-04 (V6 & GT) so if you already have and 8.8 housing from an 86-98 car then all you need is the 94-98 length axles and you are home free. So basically the axle housing and axles will not work if you want the 94-98 track width. I am not saying the 99 rear will not work but you will be getting into some funky offsets and backspacing.

I would be curious if anyone knew the axle to axle length of the Mark VII rear end. I know some folks here have used that rear end so if the 09-04 is the same length (would not surprise me one bit) then we have our answer but wheel selection will play its part.

4 to 5 lug swap

Reply #48 – March 05, 2015, 09:29:58 PM

Darren, I do believe the Mark VII rear is 1/2" wider, to , than the '94-'98 Mustang rear.

Looking at the axle data chart (it shows no to measure for Mark 7 btw) it has the '99-04 Mustang axles as having, as nearly as I can tell...1/4" more length than Mark VIII...

4 to 5 lug swap

Reply #49 – March 05, 2015, 09:44:02 PM

Yeah...pays to check that thread that so many toiled over. We need to get one of the Mark VII owners to do some wheel removal and provide that data.

4 to 5 lug swap

Reply #50 – March 05, 2015, 09:56:32 PM

I'm going to the yard(s) tomorrow...if there's a mark VIII, maybe my buddy and I can find a way to get that to number. If I can just reemmber to take my tape measure and a couple of somethings or another to lay across the axle s....

4 to 5 lug swap

Reply #51 – March 06, 2015, 06:28:13 PM

Darren, when I completed the backside, I swapped the 93 Cobra MS to a 95 GT MS. I guess air in the lines could be the big problem. I'll purchase that bleeder and give it a try. I could use one anyhow. I was pushing the pedal down and wedging a block of wood between it and the dash, then open a bleeder at a wheel. When the fluid was getting close to stopping, I would close the bleeder and then remove the wood and pump it up. I wonder if there is still air in the MC. Bench bleeding did not go very smoothly.

4 to 5 lug swap

Reply #52 – March 06, 2015, 09:02:38 PM

Quote from: Chrome;445683

Bench bleeding did not go very smoothly.

This would bring up a red flag with me, was it a reman unit ?

I used a new 93 cobra MC and bleeding it wasn't bad at all, it was my first time bench bleeding a MC too.

4 to 5 lug swap

Reply #53 – March 06, 2015, 11:11:11 PM

Quote from: Ramos617;445692

This would bring up a red flag with me, was it a reman unit ?

I used a new 93 cobra MC and bleeding it wasn't bad at all, it was my first time bench bleeding a MC too.

Yes, it's reman. If I remember correctly, the problem was with the bleeder kit. I can't remember if one of the plastic pieces did not fit, or if it even came with the kit at all. Either way, I made one hellova mess. The pedal is much firmer than what it was with the Cobra unit, but still is just not right. She'll stop on a dime though.

4 to 5 lug swap

Reply #54 – March 07, 2015, 07:38:25 AM

Quote from: ThunderbirdSport302;445660

Darren, I do believe the Mark VII rear is 1/2" wider, to , than the '94-'98 Mustang rear.

Looking at the axle data chart (it shows no to measure for Mark 7 btw) it has the '99-04 Mustang axles as having, as nearly as I can tell...1/4" more length than Mark VIII...

I just rebuilt a mark vii rear end and switched it to cobra brakes. The housing was exactly the same width as the SN 95, which made the conversion easy. I sourced a pair of axles from a 94-98 mustang, added cobra brackets, cobra calipers, new cobra rotors, and used sn95 brackets and hoses. As far as I can tell, every FOX and SN95 generation 8.8 HOUSING is the same, the difference is in the axles and accessory parts. The mark vii axles were longer than the sn95, but everything else was a direct swap.

Here's a couple of pics of the rear end, waiting for my chucks brackets and then it will be installed in the bird. It's basically an SN95 rear now, but it started life as a mark vii rear out of a 1989.

Hope this helps -

Geoff

4 to 5 lug swap

Reply #55 – March 07, 2015, 07:44:31 AM

One more thing I might add - the bearings were much wider in the mark vii housing, when I took it apart. I'll admit, I was a little concerned that it would all go back together properly, but the Ford racing "M-1225-B 8.8 Axle Bearing and Seal Kit" fir perfectly, so it was a non-issue.

I assume it's just that they used this housing with so many generations of cars that there were production differences year to year with the individual components. It's good to have a modular foundation and be able to easily build exactly what you want.

4 to 5 lug swap

Reply #56 – March 07, 2015, 12:07:37 PM

Its good to know the housings are the same so with that info the additional width is in the axles which is on the chart ThunderbirdSport302 referred to. With that info I would say the Mark VII rear end would not be too difficult to find wheels for but the additional width will require more of the wheel to be inboard of the hub.

Darren

4 to 5 lug swap

Reply #57 – March 07, 2015, 01:08:47 PM

There was supposed to be a Mark VII in the yard yesterday, but apparently already went to Sovngarde, as it was nowhere to be found. I was going to pull the rear rotors off and using two halves of a yard stick that I cut for that purpose, measure the s for width, to update the chart..

There will be another. There's a lot of gaps, I'd like to find the missing info and fill it in. I also have the chart saved on my computer...I'm not sure how to post a .pdf, but mine has updated info over the one that's stickied in the "deciphering axles" thread.

Or should I say, deciphering axels.. :D

I will borrow a page from Vinnie, once my chart is complete with ALL info in place...print it off, laminate it, and compile it with other data.

Anyway, back to topic...this stuff is confusing enough without my rambling about random, bare;y-related bits. :]

4 to 5 lug swap

Reply #58 – March 07, 2015, 01:16:33 PM

Lodemia is correct...Fox and Mustang 8.8 housings were the same...EXCEPT for '99-04..those measure at 55.534".
The Fox 8.8 housing is 54.096", as is the TC 8.8, and Mark VIII.

And also, if you come across a '94-'98 Mustang in the Junkyard, and you're looking at doing a 5 lug swap, the axles from identical, be it from the 7.5 or the 8.8....might help you out if you were looking for the 8.8 only and couldn't find any.

I've got 7.5 axles in my TC rear with drum brake setup...went together like it was made for it.

Now, I'll STFU before the thread gets diluted more than it is lol.

4 to 5 lug swap

Reply #59 – May 05, 2015, 01:42:59 AM

This thread has been most helpful. I believe it's helped me successfully plan my 5 lug swap. I have an 88 TC I'm planning to install a set of 2001 Cobra wheels. For the rear, I happen to have a pair of 96 Mustang axles that I can use. If I've read everything correctly,it sounds like after I swap the axles, I can redrill the stock rotors and machine the center for clearance, OR use the 96 rear brake hardware. Does that sound right? If I go the cheap route on the front, does anyone know if the 2001 Cobra wheels will fit the Mark VII rotors?