Alright, I'm stumped. (Solved!)

Topic: Alright, I'm stumped. (Solved!) (Read 3263 times) previous topic - next topic

Alright, I'm stumped. (Solved!)

May 11, 2009, 06:24:50 PM

Brief history-
Bought 85 XR-7, sat for 3 years (due to being wrecked), 32k original miles (so it probably sat quite a bit before this too).

-Wouldn't start at all. No spark. Changed TFI, had spark.
-Still No start. If I sprayed carb cleaner in the intake I would run on that.
-No Fuel pressure. Dropped the tank and found the notorious cracked line on the pump. Replaced the line.
-Now, it will start and run for about a second. Vrroooommmmplaaahh.

If I hold the gas at about 2000-2500rpms it will stay running, but it is missfiring. I replaced the plugs and wires, no change.

That's where I am at. Any ideas? I am dying to get on the road in this thing :burnout:

CoogarXR

Alright, I'm stumped. (Solved!)

Reply #1 – May 11, 2009, 07:10:08 PM

Check the timing? Use your timing light to check to see if all cyls are getting spark (cap+rotor problem?).

Fresh gas? Could be a stuck injector. With as long as it has been sitting I wouldn't be surprised if they were gunked up. Poor a can of techron in the tank and see if it gets any better. Or, swipe some from the pick-n-pull, clean, and install them.

I have heard good things about a product called Procleen. It threads onto the pressure test valve on the fuel rail. Then you pull the pump relay and let the can run through the engine. Some auto parts stores sell it. Its usually pretty expensive.

Alright, I'm stumped. (Solved!)

Reply #2 – May 11, 2009, 07:52:24 PM

The first two things I always do when I buy a non-op car are replace the harmonic balancer and wire the plugs with the proper firing order.

You might want to clean the throttlebody because the butterfly usually gets all gummed up. Just take a rag soaked in gasoline, wrap it around a screwdriver and scrub away. Be careful not to scratch anything, though.

Alright, I'm stumped. (Solved!)

Reply #3 – May 11, 2009, 08:11:39 PM

Here's a couple videos to help describe the situation:

If I hit the key only:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9Wz42e89-k

If I give it gas:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IAIpo1tLe3w

CoogarXR

Alright, I'm stumped. (Solved!)

Reply #4 – May 12, 2009, 12:42:31 PM

Any ideas?

CoogarXR

Alright, I'm stumped. (Solved!)

Reply #5 – May 12, 2009, 01:48:20 PM

what's the question here? Why it stalls out on startup? Dunno, my '04 Monte Carlo does that too sometimes.

Alright, I'm stumped. (Solved!)

Reply #6 – May 12, 2009, 02:05:27 PM

did you pull any codes? if not do so itll make it easier for someone to help you out here.

i wasnt aware the you could clean the TB on the 2.3 because they were coated with something, or is that only the newer ones?

danzajax, ive been looking for that procleen stuff for over a year to give it a try bt none of the stores locally have it:shakes fist:

Alright, I'm stumped. (Solved!)

Reply #7 – May 12, 2009, 02:19:05 PM

When I turn the key, I just get 11 (system pass). If I start it and rev it a little and let it die, it gives me the following (definitions from fordfuelinjection.com):

12 Cannot control RPM during ER Self-Test high RPM check
21 ECT out of self test range 0.3 to 3.7 volts.
25 Knock not sensed during dynamic test
26 MAF sensor was not between 0.2 and 1.5 volts with engine running
26 TOT sensor out of self test range
34 PFE or EVP circuit above the closed limit of 0.67 volts
41 No HEGO switching detected always lean
77 System failed to recognize brief WOT during Dynamic Response Test (user error)

CoogarXR

Alright, I'm stumped. (Solved!)

Reply #8 – May 12, 2009, 02:42:16 PM

check for vac leaks. I would think your boost gauge would at least twitch a little bit. Dismantle/clean the IAC.
Do you have a vac gauge?

Alright, I'm stumped. (Solved!)

Reply #9 – May 12, 2009, 02:50:15 PM

I don't have a vac gage.

I took the IAC off, but I don't really know what to clean in there. It looks pretty clean (the inside is about the same grey color as the outside).

I would have thought the turbo needle would move too. It actually moves a little to the left (wrong way) you can see it slightly in the second video. Where does it connect to the vac system?

I might go try to clean the MAF...

(Edit: Cleaning the maf (though it didn't need it) made no difference)

CoogarXR

Alright, I'm stumped. (Solved!)

Reply #10 – May 12, 2009, 03:54:46 PM

If the engine was warmed up, replace the ECT and test again... If it was cold, warm it up and test again... It'll never run right if the EEC doesn't have a proper temp reference...

Alright, I'm stumped. (Solved!)

Reply #11 – May 12, 2009, 04:45:49 PM

Quote from: CoogarXR;271864

When I turn the key, I just get 11 (system pass). If I start it and rev it a little and let it die, it gives me the following (definitions from fordfuelinjection.com):

12 Cannot control RPM during ER Self-Test high RPM check
21 ECT out of self test range 0.3 to 3.7 volts.
25 Knock not sensed during dynamic test
26 MAF sensor was not between 0.2 and 1.5 volts with engine running
26 TOT sensor out of self test range
34 PFE or EVP circuit above the closed limit of 0.67 volts
41 No HEGO switching detected always lean
77 System failed to recognize brief WOT during Dynamic Response Test (user error)

CoogarXR

Here we go.
12 It is telling you that during throttle related test you have to work the throttle.

21 The ECT is toast. .3-3.7 volts cold or hot should be in this range not greater or less.

25 Did you knock on the intake or some thing to make it sense knock?

26 Its is a VAM not a MAF close but different. Sounds like you need a new one or someone messed with it and it is toast.
26 TOT have no idea on TOT but with the code 26 almost bet air temp sensor inside VAM

34 PFE/ EVP sensor not at proper voltage. could be holey vac line, bad EGR valve or position sensor.

41 HEGO that is telling you that your O2 sensor is not switching like it should at normal operation temps. If you are in the right ball park of air/fuel mixture. If I remember right the 85's have a 1 wire sensor so that take longer to get to reading temp due to lack of heater to help warm it up.

77 Once again you didn't floor the throttle when it wanted you to during the test.

None of this except for maybe the ECT would cause your condition. I tell you it is the TFI or maybe even the Pick up that is not working. OF those 2 I think TFI because it has to segments Low Rpm and High rpm. If the low rpm is out it doesn't like to run at low rpm but would run at high RPM. Also check to make sure the Ignition switch to make sure it doesn't have a bad connection or bad connection inside the switch. Very common problem in these.

Just tryin to help
Stuckman

Alright, I'm stumped. (Solved!)

Reply #12 – May 12, 2009, 04:51:37 PM

Quote from: CoogarXR;271864

When I turn the key, I just get 11 (system pass). If I start it and rev it a little and let it die, it gives me the following (definitions from fordfuelinjection.com):

12 Cannot control RPM during ER Self-Test high RPM check
21 ECT out of self test range 0.3 to 3.7 volts.
25 Knock not sensed during dynamic test
26 MAF sensor was not between 0.2 and 1.5 volts with engine running
26 TOT sensor out of self test range
34 PFE or EVP circuit above the closed limit of 0.67 volts
41 No HEGO switching detected always lean
77 System failed to recognize brief WOT during Dynamic Response Test (user error)

CoogarXR

Don't think much of this is valid, given the way you had to run the test.
12 probably because you had your foot on the gas.
21 not warmed up.
25 you didn't do the goose test.
26 in your case it is a VAF or is it VAM(vane air flow meter)
26 TOT transmission oil temp. Not sure if you have this. Even if you do, it's a memory code and not an engine running code.
34 not sure about this one on a Turbo. I don't think you have a PFE or an EVP. I think it means EGR flow is too low but I don't know how it senses that.
41 HEGO lean may be valid
77 you didn't do the goose test.

Alright, I'm stumped. (Solved!)

Reply #13 – May 13, 2009, 09:02:12 PM

I bought an 86 XR7 with 50k on it that was wrecked and sat for at least 10 years. After swapping drivetrain into another 86 Cougar and putting in fresh gas, oil, coolant, plugs and wires, it started up and ran ok. Shortly after the fuel pump died from all the new excitement, so you might verify your fuel pressure. After I put a new one in it ran great.

Alright, I'm stumped. (Solved!)

Reply #14 – May 14, 2009, 01:39:15 AM

Quote from: sirius;271747

The first two things I always do when I buy a non-op car are replace the harmonic balancer and wire the plugs with the proper firing order.

You might want to clean the throttlebody because the butterfly usually gets all gummed up. Just take a rag soaked in gasoline, wrap it around a screwdriver and scrub away. Be careful not to scratch anything, though.

your kidding,, right?

just where can i randomly find a harmonic new? That would be the last thing i do,, i dont get it.