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political vent

Reply #30
McCain was born in Panama.
Romney was born in Mexico.

political vent

Reply #31
Quote from: jcassity;240485
i feel like barry is not coming clean with his being a us citizen and for the sake of saving face, one judge has granted a suit be dismissed on behalf of barry.  I have been following this topic and made it my adventure for about 6 months now and after numberous phone calls, letters to the DNC as well as calling, requesting the very information that is not being supplied, being told by the hawaii hospital that its not public yet, ect ect, finally I am convinced that for one reason only, we will never know.

Take into consideration that the rules are clear an that when ones citizenship is questioned, the lack of any response to exceed 30days is by law admission of guilt.  we are coming close to an awful day and I know in my heart , one day, someone will jokingly say,,,
"Ha Ha,, yeah right,, constitutional what?,, thats so old fashioned, for someone to use the constitutional rights card"

Here is the reason and the response of the one and only judge who granted the case be dismissed in the middle of the night.  Please, any intelligent person cypher what the hell this is suppose to mean...............  I am sure that any further lawsuit would be in vein as many judges and similar level political leverage are going to be out of circulation until after the election.

Are we in the mood for another 4 years of an illegal president?

"Surrick ruled that Berg lacked standing to bring the case, saying any harm from an allegedly ineligible candidate was "too vague and its effects too attenuated to confer standing on any and all voters."

were are you america,?,,, ofcourse this is only my opinion as it matter none apparently each time i see the progress made on where the bail out package is going and the economic situation we are fighting through.

We really need to clean house, start over.


I'm pretty shocked that, since the Constitution requires the President to be native-born, that there isn't a hard-and-fast, standard method for verifying such ("candidate shall supply Birth Certificate to SCOTUS/FEC/whatever by such-and-such a date"). If it's important, I would think we would have a procedure for it. We're talking about the Federal Government, here -- they have a procedure for *everything*. This fight shouldn't exist.

Who am I voting for? Let me put it this way: I don't get up every day and work eight hours to purchase health insurance for the people in Philadelphia County (Bob, I'm not talking about you, think a little more north-and-west). My parents were both immigrants, they sailed here and worked hard, had to learn a new language, even a new alphabet, saved their pennies, and built a decent life for themselves and for me. As for myself, I studied hard, and went to *Catholic* school my entire life (read: the government didn't pay for my education). I didn't use a government grant for college; I earned a full scholarship (take the SAT's early and OFTEN, folks, you'll thank me). Put simply, while I agree that the plight of the poor people in Philly sucks, I bear no responsibility for them being there and I bear no responsibility for getting them out of it. I won't stand in their way, but I don't owe them, either.

If people want things in life, they need to make good decisions -- take their education seriously. Study hard. Save. Make *sure* their offspring do the same, and don't tolerate anyone who endangers their kids' future. But they should live off their own wages, not those of others.

That should pretty well spell out my position :D
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political vent

Reply #32
Quote from: softtouch;240665
McCain was born in Panama.
Romney was born in Mexico.


Softtouch-
McCain and his birth place are legal as of the time when panama was not given away prior to the Carter admin.

Quietleaf-
yep there is a process and thats what this whole thread is about.  I agree with you though on your views.

political vent

Reply #33
Quote from: Quietleaf;240666
I'm pretty shocked that, since the Constitution requires the President to be native-born, that there isn't a hard-and-fast, standard method for verifying such ("candidate shall supply Birth Certificate to SCOTUS/FEC/whatever by such-and-such a date"). If it's important, I would think we would have a procedure for it. We're talking about the Federal Government, here -- they have a procedure for *everything*. This fight shouldn't exist.

Who am I voting for? Let me put it this way: I don't get up every day and work eight hours to purchase health insurance for the people in Philadelphia County (Bob, I'm not talking about you, think a little more north-and-west). My parents were both immigrants, they sailed here and worked hard, had to learn a new language, even a new alphabet, saved their pennies, and built a decent life for themselves and for me. As for myself, I studied hard, and went to *Catholic* school my entire life (read: the government didn't pay for my education). I didn't use a government grant for college; I earned a full scholarship (take the SAT's early and OFTEN, folks, you'll thank me). Put simply, while I agree that the plight of the poor people in Philly sucks, I bear no responsibility for them being there and I bear no responsibility for getting them out of it. I won't stand in their way, but I don't owe them, either.

If people want things in life, they need to make good decisions -- take their education seriously. Study hard. Save. Make *sure* their offspring do the same, and don't tolerate anyone who endangers their kids' future. But they should live off their own wages, not those of others.

That should pretty well spell out my position :D


Its sad that so many of our families have been here for so many generations. Our family members witnessed, fought, died for the opportunities that are offered in USA but they majority of the people that respect and take  pride in them are new to the country. I am luck enough to still have both my Grandparents on both sides (one is my step-grandpa legally but not to me), both in wars (WWII and Korean) to learn from and realize what I have.  But even with that I still don't appreciate it like I should. The system is flawed, fine but abusing it more doesn't help. I have know people who have scammed all of us out of money by abusing the system even though they don't need it. Why? Because unlike the immigrants that at one time our families where and the immigrants today, we don't want to work for what we have because we know nothing worse. Sure Oprah sits there and shows us all this  all over the world about how bad things are but what does that do? We sit there on our couches in the AC and heat eating snacks we don't need watching TV because we have nothing better to do with our free time but waste it on talk shows, that doesn't make it real to us. Those who come from that to  the US see the greatness that can be had at the cost of working for it. We don't see that, we see a hassle. Its sad really, there is so much more to say about this alone but since Quietleaf gave me such a good opening i had to use it. Federal assistance is for those who are out on their luck, not those would gave up on life or don't want to earn their keep. I work for my money and the Government takes what they want. Then the lazy people take it from them. I worked for that money so should they. /Ending rant/
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political vent

Reply #34
Quote from: jcassity;240664
"i believe the constitution written by our fore fathers represents a blind spot and is the fundemental flaw of our nation today"

wonder who said that ,,  does it mean change,, in a way you never saw coming.
The constitution's a funny thing. Both sides (left and right) hide behind it, both sides accuse the other of misinterpreting it, and both sides frequently use it in court to push their own agenda. When the constitution works for your side (not you, personally, Scott), great, but when it works for the other side it's an out-dated rag that should be either sped, rewritten, or amended to back you up.

Examples: The right frequently uses the second amendment to justify owning guns, while the left frequently uses the first amendment to keep God out of classrooms. Even funnier, often both sides will frequently use the same amendment but interpret it in a way that suits their cause. Religious folk will cite the first amendment (freedom of religion) while trying to prevent something like same shag marriage, while the left will use the same amendment to prevent the religious from forcing their views upon those who don't share those views. Indeed, the constitution has so many inconsistencies, contradictions, and items that could be interpreted many different ways, depending on what you want it to say, that it could give the bible itself a run for its money...
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political vent

Reply #35
Quote from: jcassity;240667
Softtouch-
McCain and his birth place are legal as of the time when panama was not given away prior to the Carter admin.

McCain is definitely a citizen, however it isn't actually clear if he is a "natural born" citizen.

In 1790, Congress passed legislation stating that children born outside the US to US citizens were natural born[1]. However, this legislation was supplanted in 1795 with wording that removed the natural born portion[2][3]. The Supreme Court has yet to rule decisively on what natural born means. There is no solid legal precedent as to what natural born is.

That being said, if it ever went to court, I'm sure McCain would be found to be a natural born citizen. Still, it isn't set in stone that he is.

political vent

Reply #36
I had a nice long page and a half rant typed out, and then firefox crashed when I clicked post. Oh well, maybe everyone won't hate me now that none of that got out.
Quote from: jcassity
I honestly dont think you could exceed the cost of a new car buy installing new *stock* parts everywhere in your coug our tbird. Its just plain impossible. You could revamp the entire drivetrain/engine/suspenstion and still come out ahead.
Hooligans! 
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political vent

Reply #37
Quote
I do have the facts,, and nonetheless,he is in violation of Rule 36.


Rule 36: If it exists, someone has a fetish for it. No exceptions.
:hick:

If they both got this far in this thing then obviously whomever checks this stuff out deemed them both viable.  We have to deal with it at this point...like it or not.

 
Quote
Indeed, the constitution has so many inconsistencies, contradictions, and items that could be interpreted many different ways, depending on what you want it to say, that it could give the bible itself a run for its money...


I got $100 says that they were all high when they wrote it....
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political vent

Reply #38
I still find it dissapointing that these are the main issues of the day, when there are so many truly important issues to consider. At this point, what do you think is going to happen? Are they going to disallow either candidate and start the whole process over again? No. Are you going to vote based on where a guy was born, or what his plans or policies are? One is the most important thing to consider for the next four years whilst the other is a side note. It just shows that your election really is all about personal attacks and not real politics. If you want to attack something, attack his plans, not his birthplace. If his birthplace is the most important thing you can denounce about the guy at this point, then there really must not be anything wrong with his platform.

political vent

Reply #39
Quote
If his birthplace is the most important thing you can denounce about the guy at this point, then there really must not be anything wrong with his platform.


What if both of their platforms are equally bad?

Food for thought...
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political vent

Reply #40
Quote from: V8Demon;240727
Rule 36: If it exists, someone has a fetish for it. No exceptions.
:hick:

 
Really likin' that one. Yup. Good one hahahaha
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political vent

Reply #41
Quote
I still find it dissapointing that these are the main issues of the day, when there are so many truly important issues to consider. At this point, what do you think is going to happen? Are they going to disallow either candidate and start the whole process over again? No. Are you going to vote based on where a guy was born, or what his plans or policies are? One is the most important thing to consider for the next four years whilst the other is a side note. It just shows that your election really is all about personal attacks and not real politics. If you want to attack something, attack his plans, not his birthplace. If his birthplace is the most important thing you can denounce about the guy at this point, then there really must not be anything wrong with his platform.

more of the same mccain is a better bet than the alternative. i cant stand him. he is a terrible candidate. nobody is excited about him and there is no reason to be. but at least he is an american who loves his country. he may not be the ideal patriot, but you certainly cant say he is un-american like could be argued about his opponent. democrats win either way. B man is the ultimate, affermative action hire. if you ask most people who plan to vote for him why, they cant give you an answer other than "change". its a , ambarasing joke. i rather not see the change this socialist, racist man would like to bring.
 
 fully aware that i may sound like a racist (given the fact that anything you say about him is misconstrude as racist if your not for him), he is in the race for one reason and one reason only, cause of his color. if his name was something like tom o'mally from kentucky or something, given everything else about him was the same, he would never have been even considered.
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political vent

Reply #42
Who said anything about McCain? I'm the farthest thing from a Republican you'll ever meet. I wouldn't try to sway any of you either way. I don't believe in telling someone how to vote. I just hate to see people vote for the wrong reasons. If a person is going to vote based on how old Obama's mother was when he was born (or how old she was when she left the country, if she did), they may as well not vote at all. If she was born a year earlier, would that make his platform more appealing? No, because it doesn't mean shiznit, when it's all said and done.

And Demon, if they both have py platforms, at least pick the least py of the two, not the one who dug up more dirt on the other guy. ;) It's splitting hairs when there's a boulder waiting on the cliff's edge to bash your head into the ground. The US economy is so  important to the world economy right now. Please just vote smart, not over petty details that don't affect how the country will be run. If that means McCain is the better choice, to you, then go vote red.

political vent

Reply #43
Quote

Who said anything about McCain? I'm the farthest thing from a Republican you'll ever meet. I wouldn't try to sway any of you either way. I don't believe in telling someone how to vote. I just hate to see people vote for the wrong reasons. If a person is going to vote based on how old Obama's mother was when he was born (or how old she was when she left the country, if she did), they may as well not vote at all. If she was born a year earlier, would that make his platform more appealing? No, because it doesn't mean shiznit, when it's all said and done.

mccain asside, what would be the right reasons to vote for obama? my point on him ans his voters was that most of them dont have a ligit reason or even know why they are going to vote for him.
 
mccain is barely a republican, there is no real republican running in this race.
 
im sure we would have to agree that knowbody is going to vote or not vote on how old Bs mom was when she had him HOWEVER, if for any reason he isnt a lagit born in the usa american than that disqualifies him. end of discussion. i dont care if they found out he wasnt one day before the election. if thats the case he should be out. period.
:america: 1988 Thunderbird Sport, Former 4.6 DOHC T56 conversion project.

Rest of the country, Welcome to Massachusettes. Enjoy your stay.

 
Halfbreed... Mango Orange Y2K Mustang GT
FRPP complete 2000 Cobra engine swap, T56 n' junk...
~John~

political vent

Reply #44
Hey oldraven and thunderchicken,, this response is to the two of you,,,,
and as long as we keep it clean, its not a bad thread everyone,, just constructive advise from eachother.

Oldraven...I see your point
I see that i have not represented myself correctly and im sorry for that.  The reason for my focus on BO was as a result of so many other things that were sour.  Based on these reasons to include latest information , i decided that at the very least, a fundemental portion of a mans ability to run for office be met without question.  As i stated before, McCain falls under a territory that was under US Control prior to the Carter admin.  Carter gave Panama back as a huge mistake and we pay for it to this day.
I do not think that the three max dollar figures BO and his buddy have quoted for who is going to see increased taxes makes any sense.  One speach he says 250k / year, and in another he says 200k/year while his buddy says 150k/year.  My thoughts are he wants a chicken in every pot and a car in every driveway.  To my amazement, he said that in his own way.  He will make sure everyone has a job, has a house and has a car  I have common sense and i tell you today as i am usually right about this stuff,, if that man gets into office the dems will not be able to control him. 
My basic point is we have too many issues and drama and little room in our chaos to absorb more new drama and chaos without fixing some old problems.  His solution is to put everyone on the same playing field mandating you be put in a catagory forcing you to give away your hard work to the guy sitting around doing nothing.  Many will "get a check" from the BO plan based on them having nothing and all the while having max'd out all previous gov't assistance by playing the game of scammer.
Im getting too windy here so in short,, he is asking for a lot of change that happens to be very bad timing especially when he also insists he wants to create a new "bill of rights". 

this brings me to thunderchicken....
Our bill of rights is perfect in every form and is and will be applicable for infinity if correctly read.  Non of thsi "what is meant by natural borne" because our fore fathers assumed we would have common sense.  This same thing was tried as well when it was in court about "illegal " alien as our constituion did not define the actual meaning of "Illegal" at that time.  How stupid could one be to buy into this propoganda.  Our fore fathers assumed again, we know what illegal is.  It would even more stupid if our constitution needed a definition for every word used such as "the".  Again, our fore fathers assumed smart people can read and define things in a logical debate without over complicating simple stuff.
So,,  our constitution is not a rag, nor out dated to say the least.  The problem is the lobyists and thier drug deals on capital hill have implanted an illness in the nation that needs a cure.  A cure would be to delete lobyists and think tanks wihch would also force the elected officials to make choices based on the very reasons thier heart brought them to politics in the first place. 
I know you did not mean anything bad by what you said and your calling the constitution or the bill of rights a rag was just a figure of speach.  , atleast i think thats what you meant.



to everyone.................
Why did our fore fathers leave england?
why did'nt they just group up and defeat england?
Why did they decide to leave?
When we got here, why did we have a boston tea party?

because they wanted what is stated in the bill of rights.
With BO, look at your new king.
With McCain, look at your new Bush.

A voter picking the less of either evil forces one to remember that they did vote agianst thier heart.  No voter should bear the burden of knowing they did the wrong thing in advance. 

with a total clean up or an honest man willing to run off lobyists, our true capitalistic society could grab hold again.

I can see many many people now becoming dependant on the govt for assistance they think is owed to them just like those who had no credit line 15 years ago think somehow they should be allowed to have a home , car, pool , and toys with no job.  I have been down on my luck and have suffered through many layoffs.  I have max'd out unemployment benefits and at one point the wife and i applied for food stamps not too long ago because we needed help.  we were disqualified for food stamps because my unemployment check of 225/week said i made too much money.  I finally got approval when we had no income except for my wife working at a gas station and me tearing down barns in the daytime and later in the evening i would shovel turkey shiznit for a local company all being paid under the table.  Yes that is illegal and id pay the consequence if ever it comes up.  I do what i have to do including scooping bird  to make ends meet.

there are many free handouts coming to a house near you and those people will be in better cloths and a better car than you with  BO.

with mccain, its more of the same but i hope he gets his act together and makes me want to vote for him.  All i have to hear him say is this,,,"i will not accept any bill with pork nor will i tolerate lobyist in my house, further more I plan to to achieve the following xyz and here is how i am going to get us there"

Neither candidate will give an accounting perspective plan on whats going to happen. 

On a side note,, our oil prices are something that I think is Faux once again.  I think the very threat of both running now preaching the idea of alternative energy programs has the middle east kind of worked up.  So, we as a nation are getting played by them.  They drop the oil price and the hype of alternative this and alternative that has little leverage as you see gas becoming more affordable.  Once they see either candidate does not intend to impliment such a program to stimulate jobs ect,,, the oil will rise to tripple digits again...........mark my words.

sorry for the long rant,, and typo's ,, i just got into the hotel here in indiaapololis and forgot my reading glasses.

thanks everyone again for keeping this neat, informative and clean.  we all need eachother no matter which way we vote.  I just needed someone to say something that makes this election sort of "click" for me.  I am still on an even keel.