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Topic: It just died! FIXED Updated 7/28/2010 (Read 4133 times) previous topic - next topic

Its me again Margrett

Reply #15 –
Well I've been away for awhile but i'm bk. Just life got in the way. Now that I'm bk on track. I've been digging into what is up with my bird. t has been sitting for a long time.  I was Pissed at it. Things still aren't going my way with Da bird. I've got the wiring all lined bk out and got her put all bk together.


She looks alot better under there than she has in a LONG TIME. I did find many many spots of missing insulation and some piss poor wires that I replaced. She starts she runs way better than I remember. Idles really nice and smooth. Starts with just a crank or two. But once she gets up to norm temp she shuts down and Nothing. No spark at all. I can even have it sitting there running and its like someone shut of the key. Fuel pump still running still have 39psi. But no spark. Please I know its been a long time running but I just got so mad at the car I let it sit instead of doing something I would regret later. So if you have any ideas let me know so I can check those. I' ve already replaced the TFI and the Dizzy several times and they all do the same thing. So between 4 TFI's and 3 dizzys they all do it.

Thanks
Stuckman
84 Turbo coupe 2.3T Modded with 88 upper and lower intake, 88 injectors, E6 manifold, T3-4 AR.60 turbo, 31X12X3 FMIC, Homemade MBC , Greddy knock off BPV.
4 eyes see better than 2! 
Da Bird!

FreeBird

It just died! FIXED Updated 7/28/2010

Reply #16 –
is it possible that your coil is taking a dump when it gets hot? i see its an acell coil. but what you described is something is getting heat soaked and it shuts down so it doesn't overheat.
2001 Buick Regal LS (DD):hick:

Got that fox rash again!

-Resident smartass! :ies:

- Don't listen to the naysayers. For every person who actually helps with your project there will be 10 who will discourage you all the while thinking that they are helping. 99% of all people have good intentions. That doesn't make them right.- XR7 Dave - SCCOA.Com

It just died! FIXED Updated 7/28/2010

Reply #17 –
Above the ECM on the passenger side behind the glove box there is a relay.for the ECM .Ford calls it the eec relay .
 I had an 86 turbo coupe that is doing exactly what you are describing That relay was the culprit on mine .
Fox-less at the moment

It just died! FIXED Updated 7/28/2010

Reply #18 –
I was thinking possible coil prob too. I swapped in that accel in place of the Motor craft unit I had in the car. I even dug out a back up coil and all three do the same thing. So I'm thinking we can rule out the coil. No the car doesn't over heat it just about gets to normal operating temp and she dies like I turned off the spark. Let her sit until shes all cooled off and VARRRROOOOMM there she goes. I'll have to dig out that relay tomorrow and see what I can find with that maybe that is it. I sure hope so.
84 Turbo coupe 2.3T Modded with 88 upper and lower intake, 88 injectors, E6 manifold, T3-4 AR.60 turbo, 31X12X3 FMIC, Homemade MBC , Greddy knock off BPV.
4 eyes see better than 2! 
Da Bird!

FreeBird

It just died! FIXED Updated 7/28/2010

Reply #19 –
Try another EEC if you have one laying around. The only thing I can think, is the computer changes strategies at different temperatures. Maybe try unplugging the spout and wait to see if it still dies like that? That should lock out the timing and leave it in closed loop, I belive.
Quote from: jcassity
I honestly dont think you could exceed the cost of a new car buy installing new *stock* parts everywhere in your coug our tbird. Its just plain impossible. You could revamp the entire drivetrain/engine/suspenstion and still come out ahead.
Hooligans! 
1988 Crown Vic wagon. 120K California car. Wifes grocery getter. (junked)
1987 Ford Thunderbird LX. 5.0. s.o., sn-95 t-5 and an f-150 clutch. Driven daily and going strong.
1986 cougar.
lilsammywasapunkrocker@yahoo.com

It just died! FIXED Updated 7/28/2010

Reply #20 –
Well did some more investigation and found that The EEC relay isn't it. Tried a spare and still same thing. Swapped in my old 84 TF EEC and still same thing. So pretty sure we can rule that out. Anyone know of a way to test the PIP with a multi meter to make sure the signal is getting through the wiring.
84 Turbo coupe 2.3T Modded with 88 upper and lower intake, 88 injectors, E6 manifold, T3-4 AR.60 turbo, 31X12X3 FMIC, Homemade MBC , Greddy knock off BPV.
4 eyes see better than 2! 
Da Bird!

FreeBird

It just died! FIXED Updated 7/28/2010

Reply #21 –
Quote from: ipsd;326993
Well did some more investigation and found that The EEC relay isn't it. Tried a spare and still same thing. Swapped in my old 84 TF EEC and still same thing. So pretty sure we can rule that out. Anyone know of a way to test the PIP with a multi meter to make sure the signal is getting through the wiring.

If you unplug the SPOUT, the TFI will control the spark independent of the EEC.

It just died! FIXED Updated 7/28/2010

Reply #22 –
Spout in spout out same problem.
84 Turbo coupe 2.3T Modded with 88 upper and lower intake, 88 injectors, E6 manifold, T3-4 AR.60 turbo, 31X12X3 FMIC, Homemade MBC , Greddy knock off BPV.
4 eyes see better than 2! 
Da Bird!

FreeBird

It just died! FIXED Updated 7/28/2010

Reply #23 –
You mentioned that you have remoted the TFI. When it stalls, feel the TFI to see how hot it is. If it is hot, you will have to put a heatsink on it.
You also said when the engine stops the fuel pump keeps running. Are you sure of this? The pump should stop when the engine stops.
The pressure can stay up for a long time after the pump stops.

It just died! FIXED Updated 7/28/2010

Reply #24 –
You mentioned that you have remoted the TFI. When it stalls, feel the TFI to see how hot it is. If it is hot, you will have to put a heatsink on it. Yep it sure it remote mounted on a heatsink right there behind the grill area above the intercooler. So Sure running down the road sure not a prob wouldn't think there would be sitting still be a thing to check.Here is a pic so you get where its at.  It was a little warm the whole heat sink and such but it was 85*F outside. I did swap on my Motorcraft TFI just to check that aspect again. Still Nothin once hot and one a 85*F day she stays warm enough backed out in the sun all day. Still the other night couldn't get her to fire back up at 7pm and it was cooler out about 75*F. Thinking about running just a set of testing PIP wires just some kind slopped on the car outta the way but long enough to get the testing done. If that does it rip back into the wiring and strip out and replace pip wires. 


  You also said when the engine stops the fuel pump keeps running. Are you sure of this? The pump should stop when the engine stops.  Yes I'm fully aware of this just one of the many things I've found in this car where the original owner hacked out the FP relay setup and just hooked it up with a fuse to the EEC. Needing to get it fixed. Just hacked the whole FP relay and harness piece of my parts 88 coug today. :hick:   
 

  The pressure can stay up for a long time after the pump stops. Yes it can not to worry if I need to do any fuel system service I have a Injection style FP tester that has a Nifty litte bleed the pressure off out this little clear hose nice nd safe. No pushing the schrader valve and seeing if fuel comes spraying out here. F#@% that .

Stuckman
84 Turbo coupe 2.3T Modded with 88 upper and lower intake, 88 injectors, E6 manifold, T3-4 AR.60 turbo, 31X12X3 FMIC, Homemade MBC , Greddy knock off BPV.
4 eyes see better than 2! 
Da Bird!

FreeBird

Now no F running ARGH!!!!

Reply #25 –
Ok went out yesterday to move her out of the shop so we could tint some windows on a buddies mini van. She was nice and cool hooked up the battery, got in turned the key RRRRR and tach is jumping. Koo mean we got spark. But she didn't start up HUMM. Just turned the key to run and guess what no FP running. WTF. So today I set out to get that lined out. Looked the wiring and found right there at the FP relay wiring I have 4 wires that are where the relay and pigtail should be. Broke out my DMM and tested them 14-12ga yellow wire 12v hot at all times. Then 14-12ga pink/lt blue nothing but finding that is power to the pump from the yellow wire when the relay is switched. Then Tan/blue wire from the EEC that is Gnd when the EEC is on. Then a small red wire coming from the Safety Shutoff box that gives me 12v with the key in start and run. So the wiring colors on the 88 cougar pigtal match what I got in the 84 so I wire her up and still nothing. I grounded the EEC ground at the test connector and still no pumps. I haven't put a spark tester on it to verify spark but when the spark it gone so is my tach jump. The tach is jumping so assuming I have spark the EEC and that would have to be getting PIP signal. So just kinda flustered. Just venting and taking a break. What to do now?

Stuckman
84 Turbo coupe 2.3T Modded with 88 upper and lower intake, 88 injectors, E6 manifold, T3-4 AR.60 turbo, 31X12X3 FMIC, Homemade MBC , Greddy knock off BPV.
4 eyes see better than 2! 
Da Bird!

FreeBird

It just died! FIXED Updated 7/28/2010

Reply #26 –
Ok got bk out there and did some more digging. Found that the FP relay that I got from my parts car was toast. Just put some spades on and extra pigtail I had laying around for those universal fog light type relays. Plugged that in and still no FP running. This time when I short the test connector pin to ground the pump is running. So I guess the EEC isn't sending the signal to the FP relay. That might have been why the Original owner bypassed it. But with the FP jummpered Starts right up. So guessing I have spark bk. I need to get her out of the shop and see if she dies again when warm. 

Stuckman
84 Turbo coupe 2.3T Modded with 88 upper and lower intake, 88 injectors, E6 manifold, T3-4 AR.60 turbo, 31X12X3 FMIC, Homemade MBC , Greddy knock off BPV.
4 eyes see better than 2! 
Da Bird!

FreeBird

It just died! FIXED Updated 7/28/2010

Reply #27 –
Well got her backed out of the shop and let her run. Once she got warmed up she Died again. Need to finish tinting the back window on my 94 cougar then back to work on Da  bird.

Stuckman
84 Turbo coupe 2.3T Modded with 88 upper and lower intake, 88 injectors, E6 manifold, T3-4 AR.60 turbo, 31X12X3 FMIC, Homemade MBC , Greddy knock off BPV.
4 eyes see better than 2! 
Da Bird!

FreeBird

It just died! FIXED Updated 7/28/2010

Reply #28 –
what does the spark, fuel pump do when it gets warm and dies? does one or both cut out? and what cuts out when it gets warm and dies? i still think something is getting heat soaked and its killing the car.
2001 Buick Regal LS (DD):hick:

Got that fox rash again!

-Resident smartass! :ies:

- Don't listen to the naysayers. For every person who actually helps with your project there will be 10 who will discourage you all the while thinking that they are helping. 99% of all people have good intentions. That doesn't make them right.- XR7 Dave - SCCOA.Com

It just died! FIXED Updated 7/28/2010

Reply #29 –
It losses spark when it get up to normal temp. The fuel pumps are still running but I've got them shorted at the test connector to get them to come on. Still need to get this lined out hopefully I can get this figured out today.

Stuckman
84 Turbo coupe 2.3T Modded with 88 upper and lower intake, 88 injectors, E6 manifold, T3-4 AR.60 turbo, 31X12X3 FMIC, Homemade MBC , Greddy knock off BPV.
4 eyes see better than 2! 
Da Bird!

FreeBird