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Topic: Wont start with key? (Read 2108 times) previous topic - next topic

Wont start with key?

I've finished my motor and gotten the transmission pretty much ready to go. However, I'm not able to get the car to crank over with the key. If I pop it at the solenoid it works fine as long as the key is in the run position.

I checked the f usable links, ground, ignition switch, solenoid, and neutral safety switch.\\I'm runing out of idea's here... There is no power going to the top wire on the solenoid. Even while the key is in the crank position.

Also, anyone have any idea if any 5.0's had a metal fan that would work with an 87 thunderbird? The one I have now is badly cracked, and most at the junk yard don't look much better.
Quote from: jcassity
I honestly dont think you could exceed the cost of a new car buy installing new *stock* parts everywhere in your coug our tbird. Its just plain impossible. You could revamp the entire drivetrain/engine/suspenstion and still come out ahead.
Hooligans! 
1988 Crown Vic wagon. 120K California car. Wifes grocery getter. (junked)
1987 Ford Thunderbird LX. 5.0. s.o., sn-95 t-5 and an f-150 clutch. Driven daily and going strong.
1986 cougar.
lilsammywasapunkrocker@yahoo.com

Wont start with key?

Reply #1 –
It still could be the ignition switch in the column.Mine had those same issues.
'88 Sport--T-5,MGW shifter,Trick Flow R intake,Ed Curtis cam,Trick Flow heads,Scorpion rockers,75mm Accufab t-body,3G,mini starter,Taurus fan,BBK long tube headers,O/R H-Pipe, Flowamaster Super 44's, deep and deeper Cobra R wheels, Mass Air and 24's,8.8 with 3.73's,140 mph speedo,Mach 1 chin spoiler,SN-95 springs,CHE control arms,aluminum drive shaft and a lot more..

Wont start with key?

Reply #2 –
clutch switch?
1988 Thunderbird Turbo Coupe
'89 5.0 w/ ported intakes, Mallory Adjustable FPR, BBK shorties and H with 2.5" Flows, 130 amp 3G, 89 Mustang comp/wiring, Aluminum radiator w/ elec fan, T5 trans, King Cobra clutch, 3.55 gears, 13" Cobra brakes (front), Wilwood prop valve, Mustang A-arms, Front Coil-overs, MM CC plates, Silver 17x9 R's, 03 Cobra IRS, Aluminum DS, 2002 Mustang dash/console etc..., custom leather seats

Wont start with key?

Reply #3 –
Have yer got the fusible links on the right side of the solenoid? They should be on the side closest to the battery.

Ye'll need a test light to go any further. First check the big yeller wires at the ignition switch for power. They should be hot at all times, if not you've either got a bad fusible link or they're not on the solenoid correctly. If they do have power, check the red wire with light blue stripe at the ignition switch for power when the key is in "start". If it doesn't have power the switch or connector is fvcked. If it does have power, check at the solenoid. If there's no power there but power at the ignition switch the problem is somewhere in between, likely the neutral safety switch or its connections. Try holding the key in "START" while wiggling the shifter around. Also try starting with the car in neutral rather than park.
2015 Mustang GT Premium - 5.0, 6-speed, Guard Green - too much awesome for one car

1988 5.0 Thunderbird :birdsmily: SOLD SEPT 11 2010: TC front clip/hood ♣ Body & paint completed Oct 2007 ♣ 3.55 TC rear end and front brakes ♣ TC interior ♣ CHE rear control arms (adjustable lowers) ♣ 2001 Bullitt springs ♣ Energy suspension poly busings ♣ Kenne Brown subframe connectors ♣ CWE engine mounts ♣ Thundercat sequential turn signals ♣ Explorer overhead console (temp/compass display) ♣ 2.25" off-road dual exhaust ♣ T-5 transmission swap completed Jan 2009 ♣

Wont start with key?

Reply #4 –
If the lamp out warning lights come on in "start" you have gotten through the ignition switch and the neutral safety switch OK, and connector wise you are out from under the car.

Wont start with key?

Reply #5 –
Quote from: Thunder Chicken;215092
Have yer got the fusible links on the right side of the solenoid? They should be on the side closest to the battery.

Ye'll need a test light to go any further. First check the big yeller wires at the ignition switch for power. They should be hot at all times, if not you've either got a bad fusible link or they're not on the solenoid correctly. If they do have power, check the red wire with light blue stripe at the ignition switch for power when the key is in "start". If it doesn't have power the switch or connector is fvcked. If it does have power, check at the solenoid. If there's no power there but power at the ignition switch the problem is somewhere in between, likely the neutral safety switch or its connections. Try holding the key in "START" while wiggling the shifter around. Also try starting with the car in neutral rather than park.

checked all the fusible links that had a plug on them right nect to the battery. They all worked.
I took the ignition switch out and cleaned it. It looked brand new and all of the positions flipped in and out.
I switched out the solenoid. I wired it up the exact same way as the old one, and it also started fine before I swapped out the motor and wasn't disturbed.
I took the neutral saftey switch completely out and manually shifted the trans into park and neutral at the trans. I tried both pushing down on and letting out the neutral saftey switch.

Are there any relay's inbetween that I could switch out? Is it possible that I left a wire unplugged?
I am able to get it to start by jumping the top little red wire on the positive battery cable as long as the key is in run mode.

Thunder Chicken, I'll check the wires you mentioned when I work on my car this weekend. I can't wait to get it running.

I've got a brand new bottom end rebuild as a 87 mustang gt block with all brand new gaskets with stock tbird top end, and a junkyard v-6 auto tranny. If all goes well, I'll have it going in a week or two:burnout:
Quote from: jcassity
I honestly dont think you could exceed the cost of a new car buy installing new *stock* parts everywhere in your coug our tbird. Its just plain impossible. You could revamp the entire drivetrain/engine/suspenstion and still come out ahead.
Hooligans! 
1988 Crown Vic wagon. 120K California car. Wifes grocery getter. (junked)
1987 Ford Thunderbird LX. 5.0. s.o., sn-95 t-5 and an f-150 clutch. Driven daily and going strong.
1986 cougar.
lilsammywasapunkrocker@yahoo.com

Wont start with key?

Reply #6 –
Also, the red little wire at the top of the solenoid has no power to it even when I'm trying to crank it. Its gotta be somewhere inbetween the key and the solinoid, or I guess it could still be a bad fusible link. The ignition switch, I am fairly sure works. If I dont come up with any better idea's by next week, I'm going to go ahead and throw a new one in just for kicks.
Quote from: jcassity
I honestly dont think you could exceed the cost of a new car buy installing new *stock* parts everywhere in your coug our tbird. Its just plain impossible. You could revamp the entire drivetrain/engine/suspenstion and still come out ahead.
Hooligans! 
1988 Crown Vic wagon. 120K California car. Wifes grocery getter. (junked)
1987 Ford Thunderbird LX. 5.0. s.o., sn-95 t-5 and an f-150 clutch. Driven daily and going strong.
1986 cougar.
lilsammywasapunkrocker@yahoo.com

Wont start with key?

Reply #7 –
Quote from: softtouch;215134
If the lamp out warning lights come on in "start" you have gotten through the ignition switch and the neutral safety switch OK, and connector wise you are out from under the car.

Do you mean the "Bulb check" mode of the ignition switch? If so, it's a different circuit and unrelated to the actual "start" circuit.

Quote from: Haystack;215139
Also, the red little wire at the top of the solenoid has no power to it even when I'm trying to crank it. Its gotta be somewhere inbetween the key and the solinoid, or I guess it could still be a bad fusible link. The ignition switch, I am fairly sure works. If I dont come up with any better idea's by next week, I'm going to go ahead and throw a new one in just for kicks.

No point in replacing the switch if it's bad, and the only way to see if it's bad is to test for power at the red/blue wire I mentioned, right at the switch.
2015 Mustang GT Premium - 5.0, 6-speed, Guard Green - too much awesome for one car

1988 5.0 Thunderbird :birdsmily: SOLD SEPT 11 2010: TC front clip/hood ♣ Body & paint completed Oct 2007 ♣ 3.55 TC rear end and front brakes ♣ TC interior ♣ CHE rear control arms (adjustable lowers) ♣ 2001 Bullitt springs ♣ Energy suspension poly busings ♣ Kenne Brown subframe connectors ♣ CWE engine mounts ♣ Thundercat sequential turn signals ♣ Explorer overhead console (temp/compass display) ♣ 2.25" off-road dual exhaust ♣ T-5 transmission swap completed Jan 2009 ♣

Wont start with key?

Reply #8 –
Quote from: Thunder Chicken;215195
Do you mean the "Bulb check" mode of the ignition switch? If so, it's a different circuit and unrelated to the actual "start" circuit.


It does test the bulbs, but not directly. It causes the lamp out warning module to turn on the lights.
Yes it is the same circuit that goes to the starter relay.

This was a optional feature for 84, don't know if all 87's have it or not.

Wont start with key?

Reply #9 –
i'll let you know today possibly if the red/blue wire has any power...
Quote from: jcassity
I honestly dont think you could exceed the cost of a new car buy installing new *stock* parts everywhere in your coug our tbird. Its just plain impossible. You could revamp the entire drivetrain/engine/suspenstion and still come out ahead.
Hooligans! 
1988 Crown Vic wagon. 120K California car. Wifes grocery getter. (junked)
1987 Ford Thunderbird LX. 5.0. s.o., sn-95 t-5 and an f-150 clutch. Driven daily and going strong.
1986 cougar.
lilsammywasapunkrocker@yahoo.com
 

Wont start with key?

Reply #10 –
I was having issues like this for about 2 weeks. Narrowed it down between the neutral safety switch and the solenoid, so I inspected the wiring finally and the harness was royally screwed... old plastic cracking and all. salvaged it and all is good now. Basically, what I'm saying, is don't assume the wiring is fine.
:cougarsmily:5.0 HO, E303 cam, Exploder/Cobra intake, smog pump delete, Ford Taurus electric fan, MAF conversion, BBK headers, MAC 2.5" off-road exhaust w/x-pipe, AOD w/shift kit, 8.8 Trac-Loc rear w/disc brakes, 5-lug conversion w/'98 Mustang GT 17" wheels, Mach 1 springs:cougarsmily: