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Topic: EEC tuning with Moates QH. (Read 11396 times) previous topic - next topic

EEC tuning with Moates QH.

Anyone with my same combo (see sig), or close enough, have EEC tuning done?  I'm looking for a close starting point .BIN file.  I installed my Moates Quarterhorse, and I've fed it a stock A9P calibration so it'll run.  All I really wanted was to kill the speed limiter, and software calibrate for 30# injectors, but it seems like it's going to be more involved than that.  Also, I'm still waiting for a license code for EEC Editor, I've been fumbling with TunerPro RT to get this far.  Anybody skilled?

EEC tuning with Moates QH.

Reply #1
I had Willy from http://www.dirtydirtyracing.com do mine.

I'm still running the initial tune he did for me and it runs great, perfect idle.. I'm really happy with his tune.  Once I get around to installing the wideband o2 and send him the data logs he'll fine tune it for me further.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]


EEC tuning with Moates QH.

Reply #2
Quote from: TheFoeYouKnow;449426
Anyone with my same combo (see sig), or close enough, have EEC tuning done?  I'm looking for a close starting point .BIN file.  I installed my Moates Quarterhorse, and I've fed it a stock A9P calibration so it'll run.  All I really wanted was to kill the speed limiter, and software calibrate for 30# injectors, but it seems like it's going to be more involved than that.  Also, I'm still waiting for a license code for EEC Editor, I've been fumbling with TunerPro RT to get this far.  Anybody skilled?


Going off of the A9P tune, punch in the correct injector slopes and MAF curve for your parts, and it should run alright. You can then do more tuning to dial-in everything. Turn off adaptive and get KAMRF around 1.0 and adaptive will function well. Then you can dial in AFRs. Beyond that, further tuning is all about getting it back to a stock-behaving motor with throttle response and other variables.

If you have 30lb injectors and a MAF sensor that is "calibrated" for them, the car should already run with the stock tune. If not, there may be some mechanical problems. Unless you were running a larger motor, forced induction, or had a injector-setting issue, the motor should run with a stock tune.
1988 Thunderbird Sport

EEC tuning with Moates QH.

Reply #3
It does run with the stock tune, but not well, something seems different.  I tried the 19# sample tube with the slopes for the 30# injectors, but it was terrible.  I didn't do anything with the maf transfer tables, I didn't think I'd need to, but I'm a greenhorn with this.  In the end, I put the 30# tube back in, loaded an A9L bin, the GUFB xdf and the GUFB adx. After that, I entered the breakpoint for the injectors I have (I figure a calibrated MAF can't compensate for breakpoint), set the transmission type correctly, set idle specs from the A9P calibration and deleted EGR, tuned the dashpot, and bumped the rev limit to 6500.  The biggest thing that smoothed out the fuel_error, KAMRF's, and LAMDSe's was entering the correct breakpoint for the injectors.  It's now smother and less rich smelling then before I started screwing with it, AND, with all the adaptives and fuel trims hanging at around 1.0 at idle, the injectors are finally getting less than 3.3ms PW (around 2.4 to 2.6ms).  Now I need to learn how to manipulate the spark curves and adders.  Maybe once I get EECEditor licensed.  I hear it's easier to use than TunerPro RT.  Keep the advice coming, I can use it all.

EEC tuning with Moates QH.

Reply #4
Sell that meter and get a lightning mass air meter you can get a brand new one for under $100 and you'll get better results.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]



EEC tuning with Moates QH.

Reply #6
My meter has a sensor with part number F2VF-12B579-AA  I've traced this to early 4.6L Crown Vic, etc.  Should I install the MAF transfer from that?  Or should I keep the Table that's stock in A9L?

EEC tuning with Moates QH.

Reply #7
I would think that if the MAF is not one of the ones that are "calibrated" for the 30lb injectors (C&L, PRO-M, etc) then yes you need to put the transfer table in for the MAF.  I run a 2001 Mustang GT MAF on my 93 Coupe with the 331 in it.  I was going to run the 90mm lightning but the guy that tuned my car said I did not need it and that the 80mm would support up to 450 fwhp which is about all my 331 could make on a good day...a very good day.  Here is a pretty good thread on this topic:

http://www.eectuning.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=18048

Darren

83 351W TKO'd T-Bird on the bottle


93 331 Mustang Coupe - 368 rwhp

EEC tuning with Moates QH.

Reply #8
My MAF is calibrated to 30, and it's a MAC 73mm (like C&L), even calibrated to match the MAF transfer tables in the A9P, the sensor itself is a Ford unit, but it's not the part # the EEC is matched to.  So my question is, is the "calibration" of the MAF valid, or do I need to feed the EEC the transfer table that matches the sensor I actually have?

EEC tuning with Moates QH.

Reply #9
So what you have is a ized MAF consisting of a 73mm MAC housing with a MAF sensor that is for a 94/95 Mustang or a 92-94 4.6L Crown Vic.  I am not sure where this MAF is "calibrated" for 30 lb/hr injectors being that is has a factory Ford sensor in it?  If it were me I would just get the 70mm housing out of a 94/95 Mustang or 92-94 Crown Vic and see if I could get the transfer function form one of the tuning forums.  It is supposed to be almost identical to the Fox Mustang 5.0 55mm MAF transfer function but according to a lot of folks will need some tweeking when the hp levels get past 250 or so.

You need to start with a known and matching MAF so that you are not chasing your tail.

Darren

83 351W TKO'd T-Bird on the bottle


93 331 Mustang Coupe - 368 rwhp


EEC tuning with Moates QH.

Reply #11
I'm going to sound grumpy here. :grinno: It's 2015, "calibrated" MAFs are un-needed relic of the past when consumers didn't have the ability to adjust parameters in their ECUs.

A MAF is simply a sensor. You flow X kg/hr, and the sensor outputs Y voltage. Simple.

Screwing up the sampling tube location to spoof readings to adjust for injector size is just dumb. It's quite easy to change injector size directly in the ECU binary.

EEC tuning with Moates QH.

Reply #12
I'm not advocating for calibrated MAFs, but that's what I could afford to deal with at the time.  Now I'm trying to figure out how to straighten it out. Maybe I'll try to source a F1ZF sensor. Then I can install the stock calibration tube verify the correct MAF transfer, and try setting the slopes and offsets for my injectors.

EEC tuning with Moates QH.

Reply #13
Foe,

Just making sure that you understand what I am trying to communicate.  The MAF housing and the MAF sensor (the electronics) need to be from the same car that you are utilizing the MAF transfer function for.  The way I understand it is a person can put that F1ZF sensor in a variety of different MAF housings (different bore diameters and internal profiles) and the flow rate versus voltage output will be different thus requiring different transfer functions.  Starting with a known meter and sensor like one from a 94/95 GT Mustang (70mm MAF) and dumping that transfer function into your tune along with the correct data for your injectors will get you in a better spot a lot quicker than mixing and matching housings with sensors.  Again, this is just how I understand it to work from when I moved up to an 80mm MAF from a 2001 Mustang GT on my '93 Coupe with an A9L and switch chip.  Took my tuner no more than ten minutes to change the tune for the MAF and new 42 lb/hr injectors and the car fired right up.

Darren

83 351W TKO'd T-Bird on the bottle


93 331 Mustang Coupe - 368 rwhp

EEC tuning with Moates QH.

Reply #14
This makes my brain hurt! It's like tuning a SD motor by using "calibrated" ACTs to make up for larger injectors! :rollin:

So, you have a 73mm C&L housing, and a 94/95 Mustang sensor. If I've got this right: You should be able to use the purple tube (099) and input the MAF curve from the  '94-95 GT. Don't use the MAF curve from the A9P A9L (Although from Googling, they seem pretty close).  Keep the injector size at 19 lbs, and scale the load% by (30/19) = 1.58 (or scale displacement) to make up for the fact that you're adjusting the MAF signal via the purple tube. When you use "calibrated" MAFs, you screw up the load tables since you're tricking the ECU into thinking it has less air coming in than it really does to make up for the larger injectors you're running.

http://www.cnlperformance.com/Calibration-chart.php

Edit: You stated the 19lb tube with 30 lb injector slopes, which should work - and not require modifying for incorrect load if you used the '94-95 GT MAF curve. Are you using the correct 19lb tube for the '94-'95 GT? (Gold [096])