Tbird taillight LEDs and modifications Reply #15 – October 31, 2012, 06:17:25 AM Have you tried also the LED array instead of the only one powerful LED? Quote Selected
Tbird taillight LEDs and modifications Reply #16 – October 31, 2012, 09:50:06 AM Quote from: Seek;401620filling out the entire red circles (which are actually oval fyi). HA~! you to also noticed that.the more i look at lighting, the more science and purpose i see.i wonder what happens to your light when you take one of your bowls and bend it a little then light it up, that outter ring should dispurse or disappear i would think.the headlamps are just as scientific when you look at every purpose of every angle. Quote Selected
Tbird taillight LEDs and modifications Reply #17 – October 31, 2012, 09:50:24 AM Quote from: Seek;401620filling out the entire red circles (which are actually oval fyi). HA~! you to also noticed that.the more i look at lighting, the more science and purpose i see.i wonder what happens to your light when you take one of your bowls and bend it a little then light it up, that outter ring should dispurse or disappear i would think.the headlamps are just as scientific when you look at every purpose of every angle. Quote Selected
Tbird taillight LEDs and modifications Reply #18 – October 31, 2012, 10:56:38 AM Quote from: Trinom;401676Have you tried also the LED array instead of the only one powerful LED? I will try that separately later, but the problem with multiple emitters in parallel is that every time power is turned on, some have a lower Vf and will take on more current than they're rated for for a split second. Over time, this can make them burn out. Not to mention, when using hundreds, some will just be poor quality and fail. I have some 100mA 8mm wide angle LEDs that I will try at a later time after I pick up another set of tail lights, or just chop up the ones on my car already. I won't destroy ones in great shape though, which I have one NOS and two boxed up that are in excellent condition.Moving the LED further back also evens out the light.I think in person, I like the reflector without frosted lens. I will be picking up some proper bits to make cutting these stainless steel bowls easier, then comparing side by side. The nice thing is that these reflectors cut perfectly between the color lens and stock reflector. It is close on the outer light, but it still fits in there.I SHOULD have a finished product this weekend. I think you all will be pleased with the pictures when on the car. I just need to look into what the trunk light's fuse and wiring is rated for. I'd like to use that hot wire to power the micro-controller and tail lights. It's 4A for the tails and 3A for the trunk lighting...I don't think there's any other always-hot wire already in the back? I'd really prefer to not need to change everything to use the tail light's wires... Quote Selected
Tbird taillight LEDs and modifications Reply #19 – October 31, 2012, 05:55:57 PM yellow wire on the contact side of your fuel pump relay is hot at all times, could branch off there for a small distribution block for any power needs, plenty of overhead on that circuit to parallel off of / fuse up. Quote Selected
Tbird taillight LEDs and modifications Reply #20 – October 31, 2012, 11:32:36 PM I just can't decide. Got a second bowl cut and then my grinding stone shattered. The frosted middle lens really does make the red lens look this dull in person, like it's really dirty or something. I'd say it has more of the BMW tail light look which is a wall of color, rather than most tail lights you see on the road today where it's much more transparent and you can see where larger quantities of light hit the reflector and bounce at you.You can really tell from this picture (dim) how much more it illuminates though: Quote Selected
Tbird taillight LEDs and modifications Reply #21 – November 01, 2012, 02:57:53 AM I agree with you on that Quote Selected
Tbird taillight LEDs and modifications Reply #22 – November 01, 2012, 05:11:26 AM Quote from: Seek;401692I will try that separately later, but the problem with multiple emitters in parallel is that every time power is turned on, some have a lower Vf and will take on more current than they're rated for for a split second. Over time, this can make them burn out. That's not the correct setup. You should use serioparallel setup, where each serie should have it's own resistor. This works fine and if one led die, only few neighbour LEDs go out without any influences to the rest of the circuit. Quote Selected
Tbird taillight LEDs and modifications Reply #23 – November 01, 2012, 10:58:11 AM Quote from: Trinom;401734That's not the correct setup. You should use serioparallel setup, where each serie should have it's own resistor. This works fine and if one led die, only few neighbour LEDs go out without any influences to the rest of the circuit. Yes, there would be 4-5 emitters in series (depending on the Vf), but I wouldn't use resistors as the LED driver is already limiting the current to the entire circuit. They put out 640-650mA and are >90% efficient when the LEDs are driven at 10V+ on the 12V input. How do you propose I make the same LEDs dim for running lamps with using resistors only? Having some LEDs stay off when the brake/turn isn't turned on just reintroduces uneven lighting and it doesn't change the actual intensity of the LEDs that are turned on. Quote Selected
Tbird taillight LEDs and modifications Reply #24 – November 01, 2012, 11:24:19 AM Quote from: Seek;401742Yes, there would be 4-5 emitters in series (depending on the Vf), but I wouldn't use resistors as the LED driver is already limiting the current to the entire circuit. I am confused, being an Electronic Technician, If the emitters were placed in series, one or more failures would take them all out. I believe that they could be operated in parallel with an isolation resistor between the source voltage and the anode. As for the even diffusion of light, why bother? Any diffusion is a reduction in light, which means that to compensate, you must either increase the number of emitters or increase their source voltage, thus potentially increasing heat and certainly increasing current draw... but to what purpose? To attempt to disguise the fact that you're using LED's instead of incandescent bulbs? Why not just own the fact that you are using LED's? The light panels would be easier to construct, be used for multiple vehicles and let the original "oval masks" on the tail lights continue to do the job of masking the light and thus the perceived shape. Quote Selected
Tbird taillight LEDs and modifications Reply #25 – November 01, 2012, 01:07:17 PM Quote from: Crazy88;401743I am confused, being an Electronic Technician, If the emitters were placed in series, one or more failures would take them all out. I believe that they could be operated in parallel with an isolation resistor between the source voltage and the anode. As for the even diffusion of light, why bother? Any diffusion is a reduction in light, which means that to compensate, you must either increase the number of emitters or increase their source voltage, thus potentially increasing heat and certainly increasing current draw... but to what purpose? To attempt to disguise the fact that you're using LED's instead of incandescent bulbs? Why not just own the fact that you are using LED's? The light panels would be easier to construct, be used for multiple vehicles and let the original "oval masks" on the tail lights continue to do the job of masking the light and thus the perceived shape. I wouldn't want ANY failures. I know that a single failure would kill a circuit of 4 or 5 in series, and this I don't want. It is MUCH more likely to have one of the cheap 5/8/10mm LEDs fail than using three Cree or Luxeon emitters. Anyway, if the LEDs were being underdriven at nearly half their rated continuous load, having one set of emitters in series would only make the other sets of emitters in series take on a little more current. It would take half of the groups of series LEDs to fail before 50mA becomes 100mA+ per LED.The light distribution I want only for the larger surface area containing light. With 6 lights (brake) being operated at 650mA each, that is some 1600-1700 lumens of red light being generated before losses within the tail light housing. I will have to get a measurement with a lux meter, but it appears that the LEDs WITH diffuser lens is still over twice as bright as the stock incandecent bulbs. I have PLENTY of room to work with output wise. This doesn't even include the light coming out of the third brake light, where I will be using probably eight Cree emitters, making each one be driven at 700mA. This provides another 500 lumens of red light before any losses.The stock tail light bulbs are ~250 lumens of warm white light with a ton of loss through the red filter lenses (4 of them, 6 when modified for 2 more lamps) and 125 lumens of warm white light with the same losses (2 bulbs). 1200 lumens of emitted white light or 2200 lumens of red emitted light light offers more total output, much better transmittance, instant turn on times, longer "bulb life", and lower power consumption. Stock bulbs, using 6 rear brake lights, are consuming 180W, versus 42W of my LED setup using six triple-emitter stars and 10 total single-emitter stars. That's a savings of 10A at 14V with the brake lights on (I'm looking at you 3G alternator with insufficient output at 625rpms engine with lights, wipers, stereo, brake lights on). Running lamps, this is 55W versus less than 2 Watts (I'll have to test, but I may need 3W-5W instead), saving 4A.I don't care who knows that I'm using LEDs, I'd just prefer to keep a bit of the 80's vehicle look, but not take it back to the 60's in the way that a bulb without any real light control looks. I agree with you about NOT wanting to use dozens of emitters due to the complexity and much more likelyhood of failures. I try to follow "KISS"...I will be using the diffuser lenses as it helps make out the horizontal strips within the tail lights. Looking at more tail lights this morning, from any distance, I don't think the odd look of the tail lights when using the frosted lens will be noticeable. I plan on cutting the rest of the reflectors tonight, frosting the remaining lenses, and using some abs sludge and silicone to mount the LED heatsinks to the reflectors, frosted lens to the red lenses, and reflectors to the frosted lens. Curing times will make this take a few days to get done, but the weekend should provide time for enough layers, and in letting the primer cure enough on my other project for my carpc. That stuff hasn't been doing so well with the cool temperatures of the last few weeks. Quote Selected
Tbird taillight LEDs and modifications Reply #26 – November 01, 2012, 03:27:23 PM Quote from: Seek;401742How do you propose I make the same LEDs dim for running lamps with using resistors only?Very easily. I'd use only the simple PWM module, or divide the area to smaller segments, which each has different type of LEDs and do different jobs. For example the outer circle should be the park lamps and the rest should be the brake / turn signal. Quote Selected
Tbird taillight LEDs and modifications Reply #27 – November 01, 2012, 03:41:55 PM Quote from: Trinom;401753Very easily. I'd use only the simple PWM module, or divide the area to smaller segments, which each has different type of LEDs and do different jobs. For example the outer circle should be the park lamps and the rest should be the brake / turn signal. Yeah, I see that on some cars (also similar to having the angel eyes/halo lights around round headlights for running lamps). I'm not fond of it personally.Anyway, this project will be coming to an end, and I will be moving onto single-piece headlight assembly with LED powered headlamps. Design ideas for filling out our huge front light bars would be welcome Quote Selected
Tbird taillight LEDs and modifications Reply #28 – November 01, 2012, 04:35:56 PM After all, it's your job, your tail lamps and your decision. I'm thinking of modifying 85/86 tail lamps to the LEDs. It's one big rectangle, you know.I'd like to comply european law and still have good looking tail lamps. In fact, even the modifying is forbidden, but nobody cares about tail lamps on american cars. They are happy, when it has amber turn signals and a fog lamp :).PS: I can't help you with the headlamps, I don't have such skills in optics. Quote Selected
Tbird taillight LEDs and modifications Reply #29 – November 01, 2012, 04:56:17 PM Yeah, ANY modification to be vehicle can be found illegal or unlawful here. I know our stock tail lights are quite dim compared to a lot of cars (likely due to the huge voltage drop) so getting them to a better level, using less power, and not having them get dim when the engine shuts off is a nice update. Everything else, I really care most about just having three round lights with the black louvers visible. Help bring out the small details that are often overlooked on these cars.I can't get that filter lense polished up well enough though. Those louvers really make it difficult to get a good buffing. It's possible the lens I'm working with just has issues though, as I look at it close up, the plastic has orange/brown swirls in spots beep within it (not surface). Quote Selected
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