dirt track turbo

Topic: dirt track turbo (Read 3350 times) previous topic - next topic

dirt track turbo

July 17, 2005, 11:36:26 AM

I recently started racing in a enduro round track racing.(dirt)The only rule was bring a car without the windows or lights.I started with a junk 5.0 thunderbird(auto) and did poorly.This year i found a turbo coupe and after a few races i started blistering everyone.well after two first places they came and told me i couldnt run a turbo or an awd.(only 2 rules)They said 3 guys called crying about it.I am racing against 4bbl 350m chevys to front wheel drive rice grinders. I am wondering before i go and do a 5.0 swap if theres any way to get the power out of the 2.3 with a carb and headers???I sure hope so cause the swap sounds tricky.

Re: dirt track turbo

Reply #1 – July 17, 2005, 12:11:50 PM

Start winning and there go the Chevy boys crying and having a fit.... A little late now, but you should have just barely stayed ahead of them so they couldn't say you were running away and hiding. I'd raise hell and ask them how they can change rules in the middle of the season... Be nice if you could convence them you'll run more weight(possibly) or less boost(doubtful) and keep what you have. Do they have qualifing??

As far as power out of a NA 2.3 it can be done, but you'll need some serious head/intake work and wild cam that will let it make power in the 7500/8000 rpm range(a ballanced turbo 2.3 should live at those rpms)...

Probably be cheaper to go with the 5.0. Hell if you've got to go V8, do a stroker(331 or 347) and it will still be lighter in the front than the SBCs.

Re: dirt track turbo

Reply #2 – July 17, 2005, 12:21:32 PM

I am am curious what a 5.0 swap would do with your weight distabution. I think that it would ruin it all. I think that would be kinda important. You could have all the power in the world, but you still wouldnt go straight on a dirt track. I dunno, sounds like they got you stuck. Would wouldnt really stick with anyone without a turbo, unless you had some pretty mad $$$'s.

Re: dirt track turbo

Reply #3 – July 17, 2005, 12:30:51 PM

I was afraid it would take some money..The only problem this is the bottom of the line in dirt track racing.(POOR boys)Most weeks the 1st place is only 100$.and we must use street tires wich are hard to hook up on dirt when ya go too much power,thats where my lil turbo really helped.the gradual boost kept it hooked.the 350's just ring thier tires,its the front wheel drives that just go in the curve and hold them to the floor and they sorta pull them around the curves,it takes no talent to do that or no setup.They ruled that class until the coupe came to town.he he.The suspension works great on that dirt .now my next question will be will i be able to use my 5 speed on my v8 just by changing the bell housing and maybe the pilot bearing?

Re: dirt track turbo

Reply #4 – July 17, 2005, 12:36:35 PM

Hay stack you are so right,it will take some adjusting,i have a factory v8 thunderbird 4 parts(springs) I figure it will take some time to line out,but i have a point to make and i hope to do it.With a ford! Thanks for responding guys...

Re: dirt track turbo

Reply #5 – July 17, 2005, 01:32:55 PM

The 4cyl tranny is a lot weaker than the 5.0 units and has a really deep 1st gear(3.97 vs the 3.35 or 2.95 of the V8 tranny). If you don't power shift it possibly it will live behind a stockish 5.0. You'll need a late 80s Probe pilot bearing as the input is slightly smaller(also longer) than the 5.0 tranny. Also you'll need the 5.0 flywheel, bell, clutch, as well as the pedal assembly and clutch cable(assumin your TC is a '87-'88, not necessary on the earlier TCs). Possibly a winning combo will be to run the 5spd on a stockish 5.0 that won't overpower the tires.

Do you still have the 5.0 Bird??

Re: dirt track turbo

Reply #6 – July 17, 2005, 03:06:35 PM

the 2300 responds well to mods n/a most can be done cheap/free

have the head cut .150 thou this will raise compression to aprox 12.5.1

use the exsisting lower and grab a 2 brl or 4 brl adapter plate from esslinger
knife edge and port the lower/ new plenum

use a cam w/duration in the 230 @.050 range with lift around 488-500

if you use a 2 brl use a motorcraft off an early 70's 302/351 powered car/truck

if you use a 4brl the 390 cfm holley 4 brl works well and is calibrated for 2.0-2.3's

run around 35-40 degree lead total >race gas is a must

headman makes a nice long tube header for 129.00 from auto zone have to order it for a pinto 2.3

use this with the exsisting 5 speed and this thing should flat out run

and have a usable power range between 3,000-8,000 rpm

i ran a 86 t/c like this on the street and it ran like a mofookie with the stock c-3

hope this helps some :)also talk to some pony class car owners as the run 2300's also

desktop dyno shows this to make around 300 h/p and 250ish ft lbs
power curve looks good from 3,000-9,200

Re: dirt track turbo

Reply #7 – July 17, 2005, 03:09:37 PM

Quote from: TurboCoupe50

The 4cyl tranny is a lot weaker than the 5.0 units

actually 87-88 t/c units are w/c units and are the same as the 87-93 5.0 tranny except for the lower 1 st gear and closer overall ratio's
this may help him on the dirt track if he decides to go with a 5.0

Re: dirt track turbo

Reply #8 – July 17, 2005, 03:15:28 PM

yeah but there is a reason that the v-8 has like a 2.xx gear and the 4 has a 3.xx. The higher gear, the weaker it is.

Re: dirt track turbo

Reply #9 – July 17, 2005, 03:30:16 PM

I went to a race this weekend where a fox mustang w/ a 2.3 wasted everybody, except in the modified class, that is. It was pretty impressive. You should be able to take care of those chevy guys without a turbo, but you'll need to do some work as already mentioned. Weight is really important in racing like that, and with a 2.3, you've got a major advantage in that aspect.

Re: dirt track turbo

Reply #10 – July 17, 2005, 06:30:00 PM

Quote from: SLEEPER T-BIRD 87

actually 87-88 t/c units are w/c units and are the same as the 87-93 5.0 tranny except for the lower 1 st gear and closer overall ratio's
this may help him on the dirt track if he decides to go with a 5.0

from my reading and compairions, the 87-88 TC tranny is identical to the 87-93 2.3L stang trannies, which are definatly weaker, and have the longer and narrower input shaft

Re: dirt track turbo

Reply #11 – July 17, 2005, 06:39:32 PM

i still feel it will give an advantage in the dirt track and remember radials will not give much traction on dirt.

and btw ford marketed the 87-88 t/c as having the world class gearbox as they did 87-93 v-8 t-5's if i can find the breakdown chart i will post it

Re: dirt track turbo

Reply #12 – July 17, 2005, 06:51:12 PM

http://www.coolcats.net/tech/advanced/t5_data.html

Re: dirt track turbo

Reply #13 – July 17, 2005, 09:29:16 PM

Quote from: SLEEPER T-BIRD 87

and btw ford marketed the 87-88 t/c as having the world class gearbox as they did 87-93 v-8 t-5's if i can find the breakdown chart i will post it

Yes every Ford T5 from '85 is a world class tranny.... But the 4cyl tranny is a whole different deal than the 5.0 unit. Even the case is machined differently to allow for the larger gear on the input shaft.

The 4cyl tranny is rated a t 240 ft lb torque, where as the 5.0 units vary from 265ft lbs up to 330ft lbs, depending on year and/or application..

Another T5 chart(this one is a little easier to read on my monitor than Erics).

http://www.fordmuscle.com/archives/2000/09/t5swap/index2.shtml

Re: dirt track turbo

Reply #14 – July 17, 2005, 09:37:42 PM

Quote from: TurboCoupe50

Yes every Ford T5 from '85 is a world class tranny.... But the 4cyl tranny is a whole different deal than the 5.0 unit. Even the case is machined differently to allow for the larger gear on the input shaft.

The 4cyl tranny is rated a t 240 ft lb torque, where as the 5.0 units vary from 265ft lbs up to 330ft lbs, depending on year and/or application..

thanks that was what i was tring to get at.

thanks for showing me this site also man seems like alot of good info/people here :D