1998 Explorer engine questions.....

Topic: 1998 Explorer engine questions..... (Read 5397 times) previous topic - next topic

1998 Explorer engine questions.....

Reply #60 – September 23, 2009, 01:27:05 AM

I just read in another thread that the EEC will try to compensate for the change in fuel pressure. The computer also meters how much fuel to put into the motor by the stock 40PSI of the stock regulator.

Around here, people don't like it when you call bullshiznit when they are trying to help. You have a long way to go still. Just because you have done things to your car dosen't mean anyone else here hasn't. Alot of folks here have more experiance and have tried all the things that they do in the magazines, and know they do, or don't work. You can make almost any cam idle if your idle is set high enough. Is yours at the stock 600RPM in gear?

I'm not a know it all by any stretch, but it bothers me that you would come in here and say that nobody know anything and act like your tough because you have swapped a cam. You also asked help from the same people when you did it.

1998 Explorer engine questions.....

Reply #61 – September 23, 2009, 07:03:47 AM

Let's just get back to subject and no arguing.I'm trying to figure out what the push rod situation will be once I get the cam.I'm going with V8Demon's Trick Flow cam and will sell my E303 and go from there.I guess I can wonder about push rods all I want,but won't make a difference until I get the cam and springs installed.As far as Mas Air and injectors.I'll keep the 19's and 73mm meter until I find a C&L meter and sensor (for 24's) then install them eventually.No rush.For what I will have,I think 19's will work,but I am not sure of their limitations.

1998 Explorer engine questions.....

Reply #62 – September 23, 2009, 09:36:29 AM

Quote from: Haystack;292276

I just read in another thread that the EEC will try to compensate for the change in fuel pressure. The computer also meters how much fuel to put into the motor by the stock 40PSI of the stock regulator.

Around here, people don't like it when you call bullshiznit when they are trying to help. You have a long way to go still. Just because you have done things to your car dosen't mean anyone else here hasn't. Alot of folks here have more experiance and have tried all the things that they do in the magazines, and know they do, or don't work. You can make almost any cam idle if your idle is set high enough. Is yours at the stock 600RPM in gear?

I'm not a know it all by any stretch, but it bothers me that you would come in here and say that nobody know anything and act like your tough because you have swapped a cam. You also asked help from the same people when you did it.

please re-read my post. i said NOTHING about the people on this website except that most seem to know what they are talking about when they answer a question. it idles at about 750 in gear, 850 in park/nuetral, which is about as low as any cammed 5.0 i have seen. i never acted "tough" because i have a cam. i simply said that you cannot believe everything that is said on the internet because my car runs perfect with the cam. no hesitation, no driveability problems, none of the problems that they say come along with a cam in a speed density car. then again my car has proven to be a freak and do things that other cars just like it will not do.

1998 Explorer engine questions.....

Reply #63 – September 23, 2009, 09:39:12 AM

anyways, back to the subject at hand because i am also interested in the same setup for the stang i'm picking up.

1998 Explorer engine questions.....

Reply #64 – September 23, 2009, 01:22:51 PM

Quote from: vinnietbird;292282

Let's just get back to subject and no arguing.I'm trying to figure out what the push rod situation will be once I get the cam.I'm going with V8Demon's Trick Flow cam and will sell my E303 and go from there.I guess I can wonder about push rods all I want,but won't make a difference until I get the cam and springs installed.As far as Mas Air and injectors.I'll keep the 19's and 73mm meter until I find a C&L meter and sensor (for 24's) then install them eventually.No rush.For what I will have,I think 19's will work,but I am not sure of their limitations.

stock lenght should be fine it's not a regrind

1998 Explorer engine questions.....

Reply #65 – September 23, 2009, 04:35:19 PM

Quote from: vinnietbird;292282

Let's just get back to subject and no arguing.I'm trying to figure out what the push rod situation will be once I get the cam.I'm going with V8Demon's Trick Flow cam and will sell my E303 and go from there.I guess I can wonder about push rods all I want,but won't make a difference until I get the cam and springs installed.As far as Mas Air and injectors.I'll keep the 19's and 73mm meter until I find a C&L meter and sensor (for 24's) then install them eventually.No rush.For what I will have,I think 19's will work,but I am not sure of their limitations.

Measure the pushrod, ie get a push rod length checker. It's the best way to tell if you need a different size push rod

1998 Explorer engine questions.....

Reply #66 – September 23, 2009, 05:40:06 PM

I'll check them when I get the heads finished and the cam gets here.That'll take a few weeks I'm sure before I get the heads done.I have to come up with $250.00 for that.More parts are gonna have to be sold apparently.

1998 Explorer engine questions.....

Reply #67 – September 23, 2009, 05:51:08 PM

Vinnie, you still have pedestal rockers right?

1998 Explorer engine questions.....

Reply #68 – September 23, 2009, 05:53:29 PM

Yes Sir.Why,do you need my roller rockers?

1998 Explorer engine questions.....

Reply #69 – September 23, 2009, 06:21:46 PM

No, My motor is done. But what you got?,There's always the black cat.
Unless you are shaving the heads you got there should not be a problem with the pushrods. You may need a shim kit like I told you when you did the E cam.

1998 Explorer engine questions.....

Reply #70 – September 23, 2009, 09:59:51 PM

I do have shims under the rockers.I didn't want the heads shaved,but they did it anyway.I'll be selling my 1.6 roller rockers when it's time to swap engines........maybe.LOL.I can't ever make up my mind until the last minute......sometimes.

1998 Explorer engine questions.....

Reply #71 – October 13, 2009, 09:53:40 PM

Alright,I got the cam today.It'll be installed tomorrow after work,then,I have to get the front cover clean and bead blasted (and clear coat).I also have to paint the oil pan and block before the pretty aluminum is installed.All I need now are a few gaskets,seals,and the heads done.I'll call the machine shop tomorrow and make plans from there.

1998 Explorer engine questions.....

Reply #72 – October 13, 2009, 11:00:39 PM

I'd like to share a few things with you Vinnie. You mentioned that you're buying new valve springs for your "P" heads. If you already know any of what I'm about to tell you, I'm sorry. I'm not trying to insult your intelligence, or anything. I just want to make sure that you do know the information I'm about to share with you.

The factory exhaust springs on your "P" heads are shorter than the intake springs. The spring locator area under where the exhaust springs sit is about .100" higher than the spring locator area of the heads where the intake springs sit. If you buy a conventional valve spring/retainer/locks set for these heads, they won't work without machining down the higher exhaust locater areas to the same height as the intakes, or a song and dance.

To compensate for this funny set-up, Ford used exhaust springs that were shorter in height on these heads, so the seat pressure on the exhaust valves would match the intake valve's seat pressure. If you want to use normal valve springs, locks and retainers without having to machine the heads, there is a way you can do it. If you shim the intake springs up to an installed height of 1.750" and use +.050" locks on the exhaust springs (giving them an installed height of 1.750" too), you'll have even seat pressure across the board. Your seat pressure will just be a little higher than 120#.

Trick Flow calls for an installed height of 1.800" and a seat pressure of 120# on the spec card for their Stage 1 cams. I think the best way to do it, would be to buy a set of springs/retainers/locks that are designed to be used on "P" heads. That's what I did for my engine. There are (or I should say "were") 3 different brands of springs sets like that for "P" heads. Crane used to make a set for "P" heads before they went out of business, Ford Motorsport offered a set (identical to the Crane set, because Crane made them for FMS) and Trick Flow still makes a set. After a lot of research, I elected to stay away from the Trick Flow springs. They don't have as much seat pressure as the Crane springs and the retainers are allegedly quality.

I don't know how the TFS spring set allows you to come up with a 1.800" installed height on the exhaust springs to match the install height of the intakes. I can tell you though, that the Crane/Motorsport sets use +.050" retainers and +.050" locks on the exhaust side to raise them to the same height as the intakes. If you get them, you'll see that half of the retainers have a dish (exhaust retainers) and half of them don't (obviously intake).

Now that Crane has reopened, they claim they'll be making these spring sets again soon, but they can't say when (a guy at Crane told me this). Not wanting to wait for an indefinite period of time, I put a WTB notice up in the classified forums over at a very popular Mustang forum. It wasn't long before A guy who was selling a Motorsport set contacted me and I bought his. Problem solved.

I hope I caught you before you bought the wrong set Vinnie. If you have any questions about any of this, be sure to let me know. So that you know, it seems like the FMS sets are easier to find than the Crane sets. If you decide to look for a FMS set, the part#'s are... M-6514-B50 (FMS retainers) and M-6513-A50 (springs). You can buy +.050" locks anywhere.

I hope this info helped you.

Quote from: vinnietbird;294712

Alright,I got the cam today.It'll be installed tomorrow after work,then,I have to get the front cover clean and bead blasted (and clear coat).I also have to paint the oil pan and block before the pretty aluminum is installed.All I need now are a few gaskets,seals,and the heads done.I'll call the machine shop tomorrow and make plans from there.

1998 Explorer engine questions.....

Reply #73 – October 14, 2009, 01:02:22 AM

FYI -- Here's Vinnie's spring specs

Quote

Part Number: TFS-31400414
Number of Springs Per Valve: Dual
Outside Diameter of Outer Spring (in): 1.460 in.
Coil Bind Height (in): 1.100 in.
Damper Spring Included: Yes
Spring Rate (lbs/in): 438 lbs./in.
Installed Height (in) 1.800 in.
Seat Pressure at Installed Height (lbs) 125 lbs.
Open Pressure (lbs) 365 lbs.
Inside Diameter of Outer Spring (in): 1.074 in.
Inside Diameter of Inner Spring (in): 0.720 in.

And the locks

Quote

Part Number: TFS-51400444
Valve Stem Diameter: 11/32 in.
Lock Style: 7 degree
Lock Groove Quantity: 1-groove
Lock Material: Hardened steel
Manufacturing Process: Machined
Recessed for Lash Cap: No

And the retainers

Quote

Part Number: TFS-51400423
Outside Diameter of Outer Spring (in): 1.500 in.
Retainer Material: Chromemoly steel
Lock Style: 7 degree
Valve Spring Style: Standard
Retainer Style: Standard
Outside Diameter of Middle Spring (in): 1.060 in.
Inside Diameter of Inner Spring (in): 0.690 in.
Valve Stem Diameter: 11/32 in.

I put just over 9K miles on that stuff. Looked absolutely perfect when I pulled it off....
I too have heard about the rumors of retainer quality as well as the cam core. After knowing what I've seen with my own eyes; I don't believe it. For a street car; it's a non-issue IMHO. If you're running 7200 RPM all the time -- that's a little different, but those heads and cam aren't gonna breathe that high anyhow.

Quote from: 88 Blackbird 5.0

If you shim the intake springs up to an installed height of 1.750" and use +.050" locks on the exhaust springs (giving them an installed height of 1.750" too), you'll have even seat pressure across the board. Your seat pressure will just be a little higher than 120#.

Which wouldn't be a bad thing IMHO. Should be right around 145 pounds....

Quote from: thunderjet302;292324

Measure the pushrod, ie get a push rod length checker. It's the best way to tell if you need a different size push rod

Also DO NOT FORGET THE LIGHTWEIGHT SPRINGS THAT ARE MADE FOR THIS PROCESS Using your stock springs will make your reading for the length low....

1998 Explorer engine questions.....

Reply #74 – October 14, 2009, 06:10:55 PM

Quote from: Dougy_Fresh;292266

what i meant is that if you had 24lbs injectors with the MAF set up for 24lbs injectors and then changed the combo and needed 30lbs injectors you would have to recalibrate the MAF for the 30lbs injectors. i'm not as stupid as people on this website have tried to make me out to be....

i have read that you could lower the FP to keep the injectors from being close to their maximum flow which makes them run more consistant. just what i had read, makes sense to me....

You cant believe everything you read.

The MAF and injectors must match unless you are able to tune the EEC properly. There is no "recalibrating" a MAF unless you have a band-aid device or you have an aftermarket MAF that uses tubes.

As far as lowering fuel pressure for consistency, that's way off in left field. Injectors are rated at a certain flow at a certain PSI. If you go above or below that range, the only thing you do is effect the spray pattern and the amount of fuel that passes through. Tuning with a fuel pressure regulator is another band-aid for not having the proper size injectors or tune.