Speakers Below Quarter Glass? Reply #15 – September 18, 2008, 08:34:58 AM Quote from: Crusher;236578.. lets just say in the back seat of the car you can go [COLOR="Red"]death[/COLOR] when u crankYou mean they will KILL you?!?!?! Quote Selected
Speakers Below Quarter Glass? Reply #16 – September 18, 2008, 08:57:05 AM lol... No they would only get killed if they hurt my seats r anything in the car. Quote Selected
Speakers Below Quarter Glass? Reply #17 – September 18, 2008, 10:41:56 AM Well, then you mean D-E-A-F..... Quote Selected
Speakers Below Quarter Glass? Reply #18 – September 18, 2008, 11:13:14 AM i wouldnt go out of my way to install speakers there but it couldnt realy hurt much. most people arent going to be that critical of in car listening and most of the music you tend to listen to in a car is either recorded poorly or ends up in a compressed format (ipods or mp3). that said, your only going to get about a 3db gain in spl and if you already have deck speakers in the back your not going to realy benifet from them as a driver. if your sitting in the back your body is covering them anyway. deffinetly insulate them with an OPEN CELL foam from the rear. lots of sheet metal behind there. personally id run a sealed 10" (probably a solo baric in a small but proper enclosure) sub and 6x8 or 6x9 3 way in the rear and call it good. the front speakers are much more important to you as the driver. deffinetly run components when possible. its better to keep super directional/narrow speakers pointed at you in a car so the dash kind of sucks for tweaters. the pods fit nicely on the cover plate for the side mirrors access. ts already been said here but ill re-inforce that a half assed install gets you half assed sound. the door speakers should be protected and insulated from the rear iand if they are in some sort of bracket, make sure its a rugged one. you want the speaker itself making the sound. every time that sound is reflected it creats lots of inaccuracies. Nick...interesting choice using a pro-audo woofer driver as your sub-woofer. not trying to poke you with a stick here but what exactly was the reson for this? Quote Selected
Speakers Below Quarter Glass? Reply #19 – September 18, 2008, 05:13:47 PM Quote from: shame302;236611 Nick...interesting choice using a pro-audo woofer driver as your sub-woofer. not trying to poke you with a stick here but what exactly was the reson for this? i rarely use large woofers.and the reason is most are way to loose and get very muddy and create a very unnatural sound.. but most pro audio woofers have very strong spyders and large voice coils.. which gives for a very tight suspension along with large magnets.and will tend to have smoother more natural bass then other large woofers.. and the other reason why i went with pro woofers is 90% of the music i have is on DVD live concerts..my old sub box was 4 8 inch woofers which was great of studio recordings but took a beating from the live recordings of the bass drum and bass guitar.. like i said before i run dolby digital 5.1 and dts 5.1 in the car and the LFE is brutal if it's not mixed right in the car or on the DVD correctly.. when i build home systems i rarely use woofers over 8 inchs which is my next project rebuilding my home theater ie dolby digital and dts allso..and the speakers will have to handle what my amps put out..which are crest FA901's and produce 225watts per channel in 8 ohms and 300watts in 4 ohms very under rated watts.. i have two of them that i have had for ten years now and will have find one more to run the subs and center channel.. Nick Quote Selected
Speakers Below Quarter Glass? Reply #20 – September 19, 2008, 01:48:44 AM Quotewell, thats absolutely not true. the reason bass would ever sound muddy or un natural with a "large woofer" is because its not properly integrated as a ballanced part of the system. further more, why try to make a pro audio woofer driver do the job of a proper high excursion sub woofer. they arent even capable of achieveing freq. response below say 35hrz like a proper sub woofer is designed to do. Quotemost pro audio woofers have very strong spyders and large voice coils.. how is this not so for a quality sub driver? Quotemy old sub box was 4 8 inch woofers which was great of studio recordings but took a beating from the live recordings of the bass drum and bass guitar.. was this a box loaded with pro audio woofers or was it a properly designed, built powered and eq'd subwoofer integrated into a quality well thought out system?perhaps it was the compression in the "live" dvd recording? dvd music has half the bandwidth of a cd and is remastered for the surround effect. that all considered, what are you using for a center. in a 5.1 setup weather DD or DTS the center is probably the most importand peice. LFE generally refers to HT applications but considering your refering to a 5.1 setup we can let it slide. LFE isnt just a refferance to bass itself but rather how its used in a 2.1, 3.1, 5.1, 7.1 etc. setup. low frequency effects (LFE) probaly isnt mixed ino an audo performance dvd. if it was it wouldnt be natural. The advantage of LFE is in movie effects. LFE has a 10db higher dynamic range over the rest of the audio track in a movie. QuoteLFE is brutal if it's not mixed right in the carmore likely caused by poor integration/improper equipment. Quotewhen i build home systems i rarely use woofers over 8 inchs at all? ever? thats too bad. i cant imagine a well rounded system without a decent subwoofer. seriously, are we talking in general or in the case of your mains center and surrounds? in general your midbass drivers dont have to be larger than 8"s but for that LFE your refering too, anything smaller than a 10 would be kind of silly. as specially considering were talking higher end audio equipment. Quotewhich is my next project rebuilding my home theater ie dolby digital and dts allso..Okay...great Quoteand the speakers will have to handle what my amps put out..already headed down the wrong DIY road there. im sure you have a nasty amp and im sure you can build a swell setup around it. my suggestion would be, if you were going to design a HT system around an amp would to at least design it around a quality HT amp.no...my best suggestion if your serious about building a decent HT setup would be to do some research. building a HT setup around 10 year old amps that were never designed for this perpose seems foolish at best. bottom line here is if you want loud inaccurate sound, use pro audio um...stuff if you want high end, accurate, sound weather it be HT or music do some research, use quality (not necesarily expensive) parts and equipment as well as be open minded enough to learn something new. Quote Selected
Speakers Below Quarter Glass? Reply #21 – September 19, 2008, 05:33:25 PM Quote from: shame302;236687well, thats absolutely not true. the reason bass would ever sound muddy or un natural with a "large woofer" is because its not properly integrated as a ballanced part of the system. further more, why try to make a pro audio woofer driver do the job of a proper high excursion sub woofer. they arent even capable of achieveing freq. response below say 35hrz like a proper sub woofer is designed to do. how is this not so for a quality sub driver? was this a box loaded with pro audio woofers or was it a properly designed, built powered and eq'd subwoofer integrated into a quality well thought out system?perhaps it was the compression in the "live" dvd recording? dvd music has half the bandwidth of a cd and is remastered for the surround effect. that all considered, what are you using for a center. in a 5.1 setup weather DD or DTS the center is probably the most importand peice. LFE generally refers to HT applications but considering your refering to a 5.1 setup we can let it slide. LFE isnt just a refferance to bass itself but rather how its used in a 2.1, 3.1, 5.1, 7.1 etc. setup. low frequency effects (LFE) probaly isnt mixed ino an audo performance dvd. if it was it wouldnt be natural. The advantage of LFE is in movie effects. LFE has a 10db higher dynamic range over the rest of the audio track in a movie. more likely caused by poor integration/improper equipment. at all? ever? thats too bad. i cant imagine a well rounded system without a decent subwoofer. seriously, are we talking in general or in the case of your mains center and surrounds? in general your midbass drivers dont have to be larger than 8"s but for that LFE your refering too, anything smaller than a 10 would be kind of silly. as specially considering were talking higher end audio equipment. Okay...great already headed down the wrong DIY road there. im sure you have a nasty amp and im sure you can build a swell setup around it. my suggestion would be, if you were going to design a HT system around an amp would to at least design it around a quality HT amp.no...my best suggestion if your serious about building a decent HT setup would be to do some research. building a HT setup around 10 year old amps that were never designed for this perpose seems foolish at best. bottom line here is if you want loud inaccurate sound, use pro audio um...stuff if you want high end, accurate, sound weather it be HT or music do some research, use quality (not necesarily expensive) parts and equipment as well as be open minded enough to learn something new.as you would say [SIZE="5"]UM[/SIZE]i guess i suck then i am no longer going to try and defend myself about audio systems or cars and drive trains on this forum any longer..resistance is futile! ok you guys win i'll become a borg!will you add my technological distinctiveness to your own?but i just have to ask one more question before i become Locunick and join the Collective.is this the high excursion sub woofer that goes below say 35hrz your talking about?enjoy and i'll pass on this system..have a nice dayLocunick aka Mr Suckhttp://blog.sounddomain.com/gadget/2008/05/more-meade-hair.htmlhttp://blog.sounddomain.com/gadget/2008/05/meade-monday-ra.html Quote Selected
Speakers Below Quarter Glass? Reply #22 – September 19, 2008, 06:17:23 PM Quoteis this the high excursion sub woofer that goes below say 35hrz your talking about? LOL...nope thats not. id pass on that "system" as well. thats in no way part of a ballanced system. thats purely for high SPL for competition reasons only. (i would have to assume you knew better being the guru that you claim to be). if you mean to say that is the only use for freq. response below 35 hrz then shame on you. geeze, i never said you suck, you did. im sorry you feel that way. dont put words in my mouth, and please dont perject ;0) i was just trying to make a point that pro audio equipment has its time and place. in a car and in a HT setup isnt it. not if you care about sound quality anyway. the only acception i would ever use pro-audio equipment would be a behringer ep2500 for use as a sub amp along with a velodyne sls1 sub eq. nice components that used properly will integrate a subwoofer into a HT system properly, correcting for room modes, nulls and gain by flatening out the subs response curve. pro audio equipment wouldnt realy have any other application in a quality HT setup. if you have managed satisfactory results in your systems then great for you. im probably just more picky than you are when it comes to SQ. Quotei am no longer going to try and defend myself about audio systems or cars and drive trains on this forum any longer.. well, i wasnt attacking you, just disagreeing with your method (not even your method as your reason for your method itself) and trying to explain why. rather than defending yourself, i was hoping we could have a conversation about audio stuff and perhaps learn something new. i think its fun and interesting to see others views on certain subjects as specially when they contrast with my own. either way, it doesnt mater in the end. i know im happy with my setup. it easilly speakes for itself. as long as your happy with yours, thats all that maters.... Quote Selected
Speakers Below Quarter Glass? Reply #23 – September 19, 2008, 06:23:49 PM This is exactly what will ruin a board.. as a point of fact, this same belligerent, know all, pen 15y attitude as witnessed from shame302 and people like him ( I'm sure we all know a few here), It's enough to make anyone sick, let alone remain on a board. It seems that both shame and blown have valid points here, I'm not saying anyone is right or wrong here.. However from what shame has said here, and elsewhere, he's either an engineer, studying to be one, or just sucks up information believing every word as written in stone, permanent and subject to no deviation. In other words, he refuses to think outside of the box, experiment, or just try something to see what happens.. his manner of replying is stubborn and makes for poor discussion. Try to work on that shame... Blown on the other hand, regardless of how his new york shines, can accept that there are many ways to do things, all might not be in black and white in a book. He learned his methods through experience, and backed it with documented fact, of coarse subject to variances. He can be abrasive at times, but refrains from talking to everyone on the board as though there a substandard being. Shame, someday, if you will, get your head out of your A$$ and try to understand that your way might not be the only way. I think at least a few people here can agree that sound is open to personal preference, that may be one of the reasons why equalizers are adjustable. not everyone hears the same way, or depicts color the same way.. and if you still don't comprehend me, does everyone on the planet like sardines???? Might be because people have different tastes. Expand you mind, you may even grow a little.Steve Quote Selected
Speakers Below Quarter Glass? Reply #24 – September 19, 2008, 07:29:51 PM Steve,QuoteThis is exactly what will ruin a boardactually, discussion is the whole point of a board. if i come across as beligerant, pen 15y rude or know it all, my apolligies. i assure you im certainly not that way in person and dont mean so otherwise. i may not be all that articulate but id rather partite in a discussion than troll and lurk around. i tend to get a little excited conversing about certain subjects. i certainly dont know it all, but generally when i speak, i speak from experiance. i dont immediatly go on defense before even posting my opinion about a subject by throwing my years of experince and knoledge out there like some people do. thats a defense mechanism. QuoteHowever from what shame has said here, and elsewhereinteresting. ill have to poke around and see what ive posted. sorry if i come across that way (to board members anyway) if anyone has a problem with me, i realy would love to know about it. im not guilty of anything that every other member here had done said or thought at one point or another. nobody is perfect. QuoteHowever from what shame has said here, and elsewhere, he's either an engineer, studying to be one, or just sucks up information believing every word as written in stone, permanent and subject to no deviation. In other words, he refuses to think outside of the box, experiment, or just try something to see what happens.. his manner of replying is stubborn and makes for poor discussion. Try to work on that shame... actually, i spend alot of time researching whatever subject im into. i have a very open mind but i certainly have my own opinion as well. my opinion usually comes directly from my own experiances, projects and things ive either been involved in, witnessed first hand or done myself. thats when im more adiment about certain things. when a subject is outside of my experiance realm, you will see me ask more questions, and educate myself and likely be much more silent, as i cant speak from experiance or share my own research. QuoteHe learned his methods through experience, and backed it with documented fact, of coarse subject to variances. He can be abrasive at times, but refrains from talking to everyone on the board as though there a substandard being. Shame, someday, if you will, get your head out of your A$$ and try to understand that your way might not be the only way. I think at least a few people here can agree that sound is open to personal preference, that may be one of the reasons why equalizers are adjustable. not everyone hears the same way, or depicts color the same way.. and if you still don't comprehend me, does everyone on the planet like sardines???? Might be because people have different tastes. Expand you mind, you may even grow a little. sound is open to personal prefferance, but personal prefferance doesnt totaly come into play here. the way you say this suggests that i may have said his setup sounded poor, where i never did say that. i was just stating that Nicks reason for bass being "muddy" or what have you isnt exactly caused in his reasoning. i may not know it all but i wasnt the one to throw all my experiance and knowladge at this thread to begin with. i was simply commenting on some inacuracies i noticed. post 14, he listed a link to his setup. i read through it and asked him a question. i even made a point to say i wasnt starting anything, i just know how people can be when criticized. post 20 warrented some constructive criticism. i just dont have the tact, command of the english language and grammar to do it without being brash, insulting condisending or what have you. ill leave it at this with you. i actually appreciate your criticism. every one is entitled to an opinion and weather you belive it or not, its an adult function to judge. it might not be pc to say so but it is. i dont blame you for defending a buddy of yours as id probably do the same thing but i realy would rather you have interjected with something more to do with the subject itself. i hope your other 13 posts were equally as enlightening as this one. nick doesnt have to take my word for it. anyone that would is an idiot. maybe see some of my points here and do some solid research, and be better for it in the end. eh...sorry if this is ranty...it takes me forever to type and i get kind of lost. oh, further more, if anyone else on the board things i suck for whatever reason let me have it....im oblivious otherwise. it might just be enlightning. Quote Selected
Speakers Below Quarter Glass? Reply #25 – September 21, 2008, 02:50:27 AM Well, for some reason, this thread is reminding me of quite the epic thread posted some time ago.. and some similarities must be noted. Nick was involved, I was involved, and someone wound very tightly for no reason was also involved. I think your words of:Quotei hope your other 13 posts were equally as enlightening as this one.Made me wonder exactly what I did post those last 13 times... and it reminded me of this thread in particular..:http://www.foxtbirdcougarforums.com/showthread.php?t=312once again, bull headed board member not really seeing the bees nest he's poking his head into. read that thread if you like, maybe see where you fit in... enlightened?Hmm, where is bird351 now?Anyone?Bueller?Bueller? Quote Selected
Speakers Below Quarter Glass? Reply #26 – September 21, 2008, 09:12:54 AM enlightned? no enterntained....slightly. your starting to sound kind or preachy "dad". i cant see why that (epic? get out much?) thread would remind you of this one as they have nothing in common. i wasnt taking a cheap, uncalled for and empty stab at the kid like bird was and while you seem to be convinced somehow that im bull headed or what have you im probably more open minded than yourself. geesh, at least my post had fair reason, subjective, honest, and reasonable content. if you want to continue crying because you think im "picking" on somebody feel free to take it to the p.m. box like you should have. all your doing here is passive aggressivly picking a fight here. if you have something to add to the thread here in reguards to its genere than great, id love to talk about audio equip and theories. QuoteAnyone?Bueller?Bueller? Quote Selected
Speakers Below Quarter Glass? Reply #27 – September 21, 2008, 12:37:24 PM I think I've made my point, if you didn't grasp it, then it's too far gone. Quote Selected
Speakers Below Quarter Glass? Reply #28 – September 22, 2008, 04:58:26 PM Actually, i think YOU are missing the point...entirely. Quote Selected
Speakers Below Quarter Glass? Reply #29 – September 22, 2008, 11:26:56 PM Guys chill down...No reason to fight, We r members of the same forum and should be nice to to each other to keep it alive..U discuss your methods and share your thoughts about what ever you want. Don't insult someone about there method or w/e just take in what you believe........ Everyone has there own ways No reason to think yours is best. There isn't 1 way of doing everything...Only thing I will say, and Im to lazy to read the B/S post above so This isn't attacking no one or anything... Just saying to.....Make Love Not War :-p Quote Selected
1988 Thunderbird Sport, Former 4.6 DOHC T56 conversion project. 
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