Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Zorin on September 17, 2017, 03:45:26 PM
Post by: Zorin on September 17, 2017, 03:45:26 PM
First off, allow me to introduce myself. I'm Tim, and I build a LOT of different cars for people. To give you an idea, I just built a 400 HP Dodge pickup for a guy, and I built a sweet Chrysler Conquest for another guy. I'm not trying to impress anyone, or come off as an egotist....just letting you know, I'm pretty handy with a wrench!
Point is, after building cars for other folks, I've decided that it's time I built something cool for me. After searching for about 6 months, I found Eric's Cool Cats website, and said, you know what....a Thunderbird or a Cougar is an outstanding idea. I've worked on a lot of Mustangs, and a few Aero Birds, but never owned one of either for myself.
So, after more searching, I have an appointment next weekend to check out a very very clean 1987 Mercury Cougar XR7. I specifically picked this car, as it has the foundation for what I intend to do, which is a HO conversion with dual exhaust, and a manual transmission swap.
So, here's the million dollar question, or rather, several of them. This car has 135,000 miles on it, and doesn't appear to have been driven in winter.
1. I know to look at the torque boxes - what else should I be scoping out while I am under the car? Where do these typically begin rusting?
2. I know to check the TV cable bushing on the throttle arm - anything else notable with the transmission apart from your regular AOD concerns that I should watch for?
3. This is a factory power sunroof car - what should I be looking for there?
4. I understand the '87 has a 7.5" axle....I'll presume this is true of the V8 cars?
5. Anything notable on these cars for just outright falling apart?
I have been lurking here as non-registered for about the last week, and going through the forum pages, page by page, and reading everything I can find. One thing I cannot really find.....what are these cars typically valued at for a clean and nice V8 model with the kind of mileage that the car I am looking at has?
Folks, I look forward to talking with you, and I hope this car winds up being a winner, because it really looks sharp, and it's a one owner car.
Thanks again, and a pleasure to be here!
Tim
Point is, after building cars for other folks, I've decided that it's time I built something cool for me. After searching for about 6 months, I found Eric's Cool Cats website, and said, you know what....a Thunderbird or a Cougar is an outstanding idea. I've worked on a lot of Mustangs, and a few Aero Birds, but never owned one of either for myself.
So, after more searching, I have an appointment next weekend to check out a very very clean 1987 Mercury Cougar XR7. I specifically picked this car, as it has the foundation for what I intend to do, which is a HO conversion with dual exhaust, and a manual transmission swap.
So, here's the million dollar question, or rather, several of them. This car has 135,000 miles on it, and doesn't appear to have been driven in winter.
1. I know to look at the torque boxes - what else should I be scoping out while I am under the car? Where do these typically begin rusting?
2. I know to check the TV cable bushing on the throttle arm - anything else notable with the transmission apart from your regular AOD concerns that I should watch for?
3. This is a factory power sunroof car - what should I be looking for there?
4. I understand the '87 has a 7.5" axle....I'll presume this is true of the V8 cars?
5. Anything notable on these cars for just outright falling apart?
I have been lurking here as non-registered for about the last week, and going through the forum pages, page by page, and reading everything I can find. One thing I cannot really find.....what are these cars typically valued at for a clean and nice V8 model with the kind of mileage that the car I am looking at has?
Folks, I look forward to talking with you, and I hope this car winds up being a winner, because it really looks sharp, and it's a one owner car.
Thanks again, and a pleasure to be here!
Tim
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Sancho on September 17, 2017, 04:46:33 PM
Post by: Sancho on September 17, 2017, 04:46:33 PM
1. Gas tank hangers, quarters above well, front shock towers, rocker caps in the front wells.
2. Been a long time since I've had an AOD, someone else will know better
3. The drain hoses need to be clear, depending where it's been they can clog. Seals are available from sunroof doctor
4. Everything but the 87-88TC has some flavor of 7.5" some with trac-loc
5. Nothing outright, some will drop the door glass but it's a simple repair.
2. Been a long time since I've had an AOD, someone else will know better
3. The drain hoses need to be clear, depending where it's been they can clog. Seals are available from sunroof doctor
4. Everything but the 87-88TC has some flavor of 7.5" some with trac-loc
5. Nothing outright, some will drop the door glass but it's a simple repair.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Zorin on September 17, 2017, 04:50:21 PM
Post by: Zorin on September 17, 2017, 04:50:21 PM
Quote from: Sancho;462753
1. Gas tank hangers, quarters above well, front shock towers, rocker caps in the front wells.
2. Been a long time since I've had an AOD, someone else will know better
3. The drain hoses need to be clear, depending where it's been they can clog. Seals are available from sunroof doctor
4. Everything but the 87-88TC has some flavor of 7.5" some with trac-loc
5. Nothing outright, some will drop the door glass but it's a simple repair.
Thanks, Sancho! Excellent to know!
Tim
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Sancho on September 17, 2017, 07:13:11 PM
Post by: Sancho on September 17, 2017, 07:13:11 PM
Value is tough, I see cars from 2-5k in that range. It's really depends on the local market.
I hope she works out, they're nice cars. Quite a bit more spacious over a mustang or a conquest.
I hope she works out, they're nice cars. Quite a bit more spacious over a mustang or a conquest.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Zorin on September 17, 2017, 07:37:24 PM
Post by: Zorin on September 17, 2017, 07:37:24 PM
Cool, cool, that's also good to know! Let's see if I can do this.....
Here's a picture of the car I'm considering.
(https://image.ibb.co/eDUvw5/21463049_1849827295058261_202157970327510024_n.jpg)
Here's a picture of the car I'm considering.
(https://image.ibb.co/eDUvw5/21463049_1849827295058261_202157970327510024_n.jpg)
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: mcb82gt on September 17, 2017, 07:40:34 PM
Post by: mcb82gt on September 17, 2017, 07:40:34 PM
Was it the maroon/grey 87 on KC craigslist?
If so, it had been offered several times. My brother contacted the owner, and there was mention of needing an engine rebuild early in its life for a lower end knock or noise, he decided not to do it. Seemed strange, and he bowed out. Mention of some small amount of rust. Pics looked really good though. Good luck and let us know what you find out.
Edit, I just saw you posted the pics.
If so, it had been offered several times. My brother contacted the owner, and there was mention of needing an engine rebuild early in its life for a lower end knock or noise, he decided not to do it. Seemed strange, and he bowed out. Mention of some small amount of rust. Pics looked really good though. Good luck and let us know what you find out.
Edit, I just saw you posted the pics.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Zorin on September 17, 2017, 07:47:23 PM
Post by: Zorin on September 17, 2017, 07:47:23 PM
Quote from: mcb82gt;462757
Was it the maroon/grey 87 on KC craigslist?
If so, it had been offered several times. My brother contacted the owner, and there was mention of needing an engine rebuild early in its life for a lower end knock or noise, he decided not to do it. Seemed strange, and he bowed out. Pics looked really good though. Good luck and let us know what you find out.
Edit, I just saw you posted the pics.
Mike,
Yes, we may be talking about the same car. I'll have to take particular notice of that when I go to look at it. The car now has 135K on it, so I will definitely take my stethoscope and a few other goodies.
Tim
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Sancho on September 17, 2017, 08:10:11 PM
Post by: Sancho on September 17, 2017, 08:10:11 PM
Honestly about the only part that is hard to find are motor mounts, 5.0's are around every corner of you look hard enough. That's a sharp looking cougar.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Tbird232ci on September 17, 2017, 11:41:49 PM
Post by: Tbird232ci on September 17, 2017, 11:41:49 PM
To elaborate on the strut tower rust, if you lift the hood and look at the strut, follow you eyes down the inside of the strut tower and then rearward. That is the area the rust starts out and gets to be the worst. Also the back of the tower and 'frame rail'. The rear quarters will get rust like any older car. The door bottoms are also a bad spot that rust. I had one that literally had no structure in the bottom of the door. The paint and everything was nice and shiny on the outside, but the door skin would wiggly if you shut the door or kicked it.
The motor mount isolators aren't hard to find at all, but the plates that bolt to the engine sometimes crack. We had a member who made badass mounts, but he stopped due to life events and doesn't have the time unfortunately. Most mechanical items for these cars are easy to find. The vehicle specific stuff can be tough. Lights are a prime example of that.
The motor mount isolators aren't hard to find at all, but the plates that bolt to the engine sometimes crack. We had a member who made badass mounts, but he stopped due to life events and doesn't have the time unfortunately. Most mechanical items for these cars are easy to find. The vehicle specific stuff can be tough. Lights are a prime example of that.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Loaded87IROC on September 17, 2017, 11:59:35 PM
Post by: Loaded87IROC on September 17, 2017, 11:59:35 PM
Welcome! I lived in Wichita for quite a while (currently live in Ohio) but I still have a house there.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Aerocoupe on September 18, 2017, 10:25:48 AM
Post by: Aerocoupe on September 18, 2017, 10:25:48 AM
Door window channel runs are no longer made so take that into consideration. You can find the dew wipes, door seals, and trunk seal but not the runs.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: thunderjet302 on September 18, 2017, 05:49:58 PM
Post by: thunderjet302 on September 18, 2017, 05:49:58 PM
The biggest thing is strut tower rust, torque box rust, and rocker rust. Anything bad costs $$$$ to fix, especially the strut towers. The strut towers aren't hard to repair but the engine has to come out most of the time to do it correctly.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Zorin on September 18, 2017, 07:06:34 PM
Post by: Zorin on September 18, 2017, 07:06:34 PM
Gentlemen, thank you for all of the tips!
I go to look at the car this weekend. Hopefully, it checks out good. If not, the search continues on, because I'm really thinking for what I am trying to accomplish, the Fox Thunderbird or Cougar is really where I want to be. I am also looking at Lincoln Mark VII's, but I think those can be a bit more tempermental, and I typically see those with pretty roasty interiors. I also understand a T5 swap in one of those is a little trickier...something about the hole in the floor not being quite in the right spot?
Tim
I go to look at the car this weekend. Hopefully, it checks out good. If not, the search continues on, because I'm really thinking for what I am trying to accomplish, the Fox Thunderbird or Cougar is really where I want to be. I am also looking at Lincoln Mark VII's, but I think those can be a bit more tempermental, and I typically see those with pretty roasty interiors. I also understand a T5 swap in one of those is a little trickier...something about the hole in the floor not being quite in the right spot?
Tim
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: thunderjet302 on September 18, 2017, 07:27:48 PM
Post by: thunderjet302 on September 18, 2017, 07:27:48 PM
Mark VIIs are fine. I used to own one. The air suspension gets a bad rap but, really, it's stupid easy to fix. Heck replacing all the air springs and compressor is easier and often just as cheap as a coil spring swap. I would keep the air suspension in the Mark VII. Now the Teves II ABS system no. I'd ditch that if I planned on keeping the car. New parts are pretty much made of unobtainium now. Convert it to regular vacuum assist with a booster and master cylinder from a SVO Mustang (same brakes all around) and and adjustable prop valve or SVO Mustang/87-88 Turbo Coupe prop valve and you're good to go.
Mark VII T5 swap: http://www.lincolnsonline.com/tech/00140.html
Mark VII T5 swap: http://www.lincolnsonline.com/tech/00140.html
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Zorin on September 18, 2017, 08:55:35 PM
Post by: Zorin on September 18, 2017, 08:55:35 PM
Gentlemen, let me ask you another question.....
How many of you daily drive your cars? I'd likely put upwards of 80 miles A DAY on this car when I drive it to work and back. Pretty reliable for the most part?
Tim
How many of you daily drive your cars? I'd likely put upwards of 80 miles A DAY on this car when I drive it to work and back. Pretty reliable for the most part?
Tim
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: thunderjet302 on September 18, 2017, 09:32:40 PM
Post by: thunderjet302 on September 18, 2017, 09:32:40 PM
It should be fine. I could dd mine but I live in the salt belt, so no dice.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Zorin on September 18, 2017, 09:47:32 PM
Post by: Zorin on September 18, 2017, 09:47:32 PM
Quote from: thunderjet302;462787
It should be fine. I could dd mine but I live in the salt belt, so no dice.
That's awesome, it really is. My last 80's car required a full and complete build before being deemed "dependable".
Tim
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: MY83T on September 18, 2017, 10:56:48 PM
Post by: MY83T on September 18, 2017, 10:56:48 PM
Welcome to the forum. I had a 87 XR-7 for about 2 years, and i will tell you to run your hands under the inside trunk area below the back window. All fox Birds and Cats are known for collecting gunk in the rear windshield channels and you can get rust in the trunk area. Pull the spare tire out too and feel the trunk matte for wetness or a mildew smell. Keep us posted on your purchase.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Haystack on September 19, 2017, 12:23:36 AM
Post by: Haystack on September 19, 2017, 12:23:36 AM
I've been daily driving these cars for 14 years. My last one had 350k miles, original engine and tranny. Can't take credit for all of it though, i bought it at 290k miles or so. My current car is a 1986 tbird. I bought it at 131k miles in January and its sitting at 154k miles right now. Have a 200 mile drive planned in it tomorrow.
For the aod, make sure the tv cable bushing is good, sometimes the radiator trans copper fittings leak, but they are a $5-10 thing at any auto parts store.
You can daily these cars, i do pizza delivery in mine right now. You will have issues though. It's a 30 year old car and the parts are now starting to get scarce. Most common wear items are still available and there is a ton of parts compatibility between a bunch of other newer cars. You'll want a back up car incase issues come up, but they can be daily driven.
My car has needed tires, and ignition switch and recently my seat back broke on the drivers chair. But I am really, really hard on my cars. I might do 20 or more deliveries a day, constantly getting in and out of the car, sometimes driving on dirt roads and randomly i drive up to 1000k miles a week freeway in addition to that
For the aod, make sure the tv cable bushing is good, sometimes the radiator trans copper fittings leak, but they are a $5-10 thing at any auto parts store.
You can daily these cars, i do pizza delivery in mine right now. You will have issues though. It's a 30 year old car and the parts are now starting to get scarce. Most common wear items are still available and there is a ton of parts compatibility between a bunch of other newer cars. You'll want a back up car incase issues come up, but they can be daily driven.
My car has needed tires, and ignition switch and recently my seat back broke on the drivers chair. But I am really, really hard on my cars. I might do 20 or more deliveries a day, constantly getting in and out of the car, sometimes driving on dirt roads and randomly i drive up to 1000k miles a week freeway in addition to that
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: fila571 on September 19, 2017, 09:06:12 AM
Post by: fila571 on September 19, 2017, 09:06:12 AM
Welcome to the forum. Check out Kansas City Craigslist 1985 Thunderbird , no rust.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Zorin on September 19, 2017, 06:54:48 PM
Post by: Zorin on September 19, 2017, 06:54:48 PM
Quote from: fila571;462794
Welcome to the forum. Check out Kansas City Craigslist 1985 Thunderbird , no rust.
I saw your car, and looked VERY carefully at it. It's still on my list, however, to be honest, I'm really after a car that I can HO-convert and 5 speed swap. Not saying your car couldn't have that accomplished, however, the lack of the floor console makes that a bit trickier. This was the issue I ran into with the 30th Anniversary Thunderbirds. None had floor shift that I found, and I found a bunch of them. Same with the 20th Anniversary Cougars.
Don't think for a minute that I don't think you have a great car. Especially being in the book and all. Because you DO have a great car.
Tim
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Zorin on September 19, 2017, 06:57:19 PM
Post by: Zorin on September 19, 2017, 06:57:19 PM
Quote from: Haystack;462790
I've been daily driving these cars for 14 years. My last one had 350k miles, original engine and tranny. Can't take credit for all of it though, i bought it at 290k miles or so. My current car is a 1986 tbird. I bought it at 131k miles in January and its sitting at 154k miles right now. Have a 200 mile drive planned in it tomorrow.
For the aod, make sure the tv cable bushing is good, sometimes the radiator trans copper fittings leak, but they are a $5-10 thing at any auto parts store.
You can daily these cars, i do pizza delivery in mine right now. You will have issues though. It's a 30 year old car and the parts are now starting to get scarce. Most common wear items are still available and there is a ton of parts compatibility between a bunch of other newer cars. You'll want a back up car incase issues come up, but they can be daily driven.
My car has needed tires, and ignition switch and recently my seat back broke on the drivers chair. But I am really, really hard on my cars. I might do 20 or more deliveries a day, constantly getting in and out of the car, sometimes driving on dirt roads and randomly i drive up to 1000k miles a week freeway in addition to that
Wow! That's an awesome testimonial there. I do have other cars, so I am not terribly worried about the occasional "it needs parts" thing happening. I'm usually pretty proactive, and downright meticulous about maintenance......my 1995 Jeep Grand Cherokee has 354,000 miles on it, and still runs perfect.
Sounds like I shouldn't have a lot of trouble with a 70 mile highway commute.
Tim
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Cougar5.0 on September 19, 2017, 08:42:13 PM
Post by: Cougar5.0 on September 19, 2017, 08:42:13 PM
Quote from: Zorin;462796
I saw your car, and looked VERY carefully at it. It's still on my list, however, to be honest, I'm really after a car that I can HO-convert and 5 speed swap. Not saying your car couldn't have that accomplished, however, the lack of the floor console makes that a bit trickier. This was the issue I ran into with the 30th Anniversary Thunderbirds. None had floor shift that I found, and I found a bunch of them. Same with the 20th Anniversary Cougars.
Don't think for a minute that I don't think you have a great car. Especially being in the book and all. Because you DO have a great car.
Tim
No floor shift, no biggie ;)
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Zorin on September 19, 2017, 08:53:31 PM
Post by: Zorin on September 19, 2017, 08:53:31 PM
Quote from: Cougar5.0;462799
No floor shift, no biggie ;)
I said "a bit trickier" not impossible! HAHAHAHAH!
Nice ride, by the way!
Tim
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Cougar5.0 on September 19, 2017, 10:06:26 PM
Post by: Cougar5.0 on September 19, 2017, 10:06:26 PM
Quote from: Zorin;462800
I said "a bit trickier" not impossible! HAHAHAHAH!
Nice ride, by the way!
Tim
Yeah, it took some planning and I still have to be careful not to crash the console on the seat into the shifter "console" (I cut down a larger one.)
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: thunderjet302 on September 19, 2017, 10:11:41 PM
Post by: thunderjet302 on September 19, 2017, 10:11:41 PM
You can just replace the consolette with a full console. I did it on my Thunderbird (but kept the column shifter). It's really easy. The hard part is finding a full length console.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: fila571 on September 19, 2017, 10:22:22 PM
Post by: fila571 on September 19, 2017, 10:22:22 PM
Good luck with search. Worst that happens , I keep another fifteen years and leave it to my daughter. She loves it already. I will watch for a console car.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: mcb82gt on September 20, 2017, 06:20:26 PM
Post by: mcb82gt on September 20, 2017, 06:20:26 PM
I could DD mine no problem. I Just drive in good weather though.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Sancho on September 20, 2017, 11:23:15 PM
Post by: Sancho on September 20, 2017, 11:23:15 PM
I might have a spare console or two stashed away, I'm sure I'm not the only one.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Zorin on September 20, 2017, 11:54:43 PM
Post by: Zorin on September 20, 2017, 11:54:43 PM
Well, it's set up.
Sunday is the day. We shall figure out then if I will become a full fledged member of this group.
It's a 3.5 hour drive, hopefully, it's not just for Kansas City BBQ.
Tim
Sunday is the day. We shall figure out then if I will become a full fledged member of this group.
It's a 3.5 hour drive, hopefully, it's not just for Kansas City BBQ.
Tim
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Tbird232ci on September 21, 2017, 06:48:33 AM
Post by: Tbird232ci on September 21, 2017, 06:48:33 AM
Quote from: Sancho;462821
I might have a spare console or two stashed away, I'm sure I'm not the only one.
I might have some console parts. Haven't been near my parts stash in years.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: mcb82gt on September 21, 2017, 06:12:31 PM
Post by: mcb82gt on September 21, 2017, 06:12:31 PM
Quote from: Zorin;462822
Well, it's set up.
Sunday is the day. We shall figure out then if I will become a full fledged member of this group.
It's a 3.5 hour drive, hopefully, it's not just for Kansas City BBQ.
Tim
Wishing you a safe journey and good results. Be sure to let us know.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: thunderjet302 on September 21, 2017, 06:36:15 PM
Post by: thunderjet302 on September 21, 2017, 06:36:15 PM
Quote from: Zorin;462822
Well, it's set up.
Sunday is the day. We shall figure out then if I will become a full fledged member of this group.
It's a 3.5 hour drive, hopefully, it's not just for Kansas City BBQ.
Tim
Check for rust on the strut towers, torque boxes, and rockers before you buy. These areas can be fixed but the strut tower repair is $$$$. Torque boxes and rockers are easy to get at, hence the cheaper repair. Based on the photo you posted of the car in question I'd concentrate on checking the structure for rust more than anything else.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Zorin on September 21, 2017, 07:17:38 PM
Post by: Zorin on September 21, 2017, 07:17:38 PM
Quote from: mcb82gt;462842
Wishing you a safe journey and good results. Be sure to let us know.
Quote from: thunderjet302;462847
Check for rust on the strut towers, torque boxes, and rockers before you buy. These areas can be fixed but the strut tower repair is $$$$. Torque boxes and rockers are easy to get at, hence the cheaper repair. Based on the photo you posted of the car in question I'd concentrate on checking the structure for rust more than anything else.
Gentlemen, rest assured, you will know, LOL. Thank you all for the advice, and the tips.
Thunderjet, I intend to look VERY hard for rust. I simply do not want any, LOL. I know that may be unreasonable, and I may have to settle for as slight amount a rust as I can get. I keep having to remind myself that these cars are now 30 years old.
Tim
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Moonmount on September 21, 2017, 10:06:29 PM
Post by: Moonmount on September 21, 2017, 10:06:29 PM
Quote from: Zorin;462756
Cool, cool, that's also good to know! Let's see if I can do this.....
Here's a picture of the car I'm considering.
(https://image.ibb.co/eDUvw5/21463049_1849827295058261_202157970327510024_n.jpg)
oh wow that car has been for sale for years
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Zorin on September 21, 2017, 10:35:50 PM
Post by: Zorin on September 21, 2017, 10:35:50 PM
Really? Makes you wonder why. I'll find out Sunday, hahahaha.
Tim
Tim
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Moonmount on September 21, 2017, 11:43:29 PM
Post by: Moonmount on September 21, 2017, 11:43:29 PM
Quote from: Zorin;462853
Really? Makes you wonder why. I'll find out Sunday, hahahaha.
Tim
Yeah, if I remember correctly it would be 4 or so years maybe longer, but 5 grand is more than almost anyone will pay for it. He is still asking 5 for it right?
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: mcb82gt on September 22, 2017, 06:39:48 PM
Post by: mcb82gt on September 22, 2017, 06:39:48 PM
Quote from: Moonmount;462851
oh wow that car has been for sale for years
That is what I thought also. It sure looks nice every time I see it.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Zorin on September 22, 2017, 09:23:05 PM
Post by: Zorin on September 22, 2017, 09:23:05 PM
Quote from: Moonmount;462854
Yeah, if I remember correctly it would be 4 or so years maybe longer, but 5 grand is more than almost anyone will pay for it. He is still asking 5 for it right?
Quote from: mcb82gt;462877
That is what I thought also. It sure looks nice every time I see it.
Yeah, the CL ad I saw said $5500. However, that's why I was asking what the current value of these cars are. That seemed strong to me, especially after seeing a black 64K mile '88 XR7 for $4500.
Of course, I always figure that some people price way high for various reasons, and as such, I'm prepared to make him a very reasonable (as per my research and everyone's help here) offer, however, it won't be a $5500 dollar offer...UNLESS....the car is unbelievably nice, with service records, etc.
Not to come off as crass (this is always difficult on line), but since you guys seem to have some history on this car, and I know I'm asking for a spit-ball......what do you reckon a fair offer is for it? I have my ideas, but I'd like t see if my idea agrees with your ideas.
Of course, when I get out there Sunday, and start going through this car, there's certain things that will blow this deal sky-high, and result in a no-offer. Everyone has those little no-fly zones, and after almost 30 years of turning cars for fun.....I sure have mine!
Thanks again, everyone.
Tim
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: mcb82gt on September 24, 2017, 04:35:32 PM
Post by: mcb82gt on September 24, 2017, 04:35:32 PM
Value, hard to say. I would guess mid to upper 3's. Just me and my $.02
My brother just bought a very nice 83 Tbird 5.0 with 102K from a small dealer here in KC, $2400
My brother just bought a very nice 83 Tbird 5.0 with 102K from a small dealer here in KC, $2400
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Zorin on September 27, 2017, 10:14:55 PM
Post by: Zorin on September 27, 2017, 10:14:55 PM
Well, I suppose everyone's dying to know what I found...
I didn't buy it.
After finding a set of BF Goodrich Touring T/A tires installed, I knew these hadn't been made in several years, so I checked the date code.....2002 date coded tires. Then, I was told that the car had only been started a few times a year, and driven around the block a few times a year since 2006. Ouch!
I went over the car with a fine toothed comb, and even put it up on ramps at both ends and got under it.
As far as real, actual problems went, I found the following:
EQ power button not staying engaged (here's a surprise, right?)
Chime Module pretty much mute (another shocker)
Struts and strut mounts knocking
Steering rack expiring
AOD throttle lever bushing recall not done
Transmission fluid showing a high amount of clutch wear
Front main seal seeping
Rear main seal seeping
Transmission pan seeping
Original 30 year old Ford fuel filter still installed
Driver's seat had two rips, one in a spot that would rip further with time
Cloth covering on sunroof slide panel missing
Headliner water stained from someone having left the sunroof in the vent position while it rained
Engine had a slight miss, and was down on power (I figure the fuel filter to be a good bit of the problem)
These are the high points:
Tires showed nice, even wear
Brakes were new
Catalyst, mid pipe, and ler all new
VERY minor paint chips
All alloy wheels in nice shape, with no clearcoat checking, crazing, clouding or peeling.
Worst rust I found was on the rear sway bar, the car was very nice underneath
Carpets were in nice shape, no real wear, only very minor stains
No evidence of a sunroof leak or water intrusion
Door hinges were sound, and in good alignment
Everything worked except the EQ power button, and the chme module, this includes all windows, locks, seats, sunroof, power antenna, frigid air conditioning, you name it.
Engine oil and dipstick looked very nice
Recent tune up and ignition module replacement
But the largest issue I found with this car, and it will keep me from buying ANY automatic Thunderbird or Cougar.....my size 14 double wide foot gets caught under the brake as I press the accelerator.
Gentlemen, I want to thank you again for helping me with this!
Tim
I didn't buy it.
After finding a set of BF Goodrich Touring T/A tires installed, I knew these hadn't been made in several years, so I checked the date code.....2002 date coded tires. Then, I was told that the car had only been started a few times a year, and driven around the block a few times a year since 2006. Ouch!
I went over the car with a fine toothed comb, and even put it up on ramps at both ends and got under it.
As far as real, actual problems went, I found the following:
EQ power button not staying engaged (here's a surprise, right?)
Chime Module pretty much mute (another shocker)
Struts and strut mounts knocking
Steering rack expiring
AOD throttle lever bushing recall not done
Transmission fluid showing a high amount of clutch wear
Front main seal seeping
Rear main seal seeping
Transmission pan seeping
Original 30 year old Ford fuel filter still installed
Driver's seat had two rips, one in a spot that would rip further with time
Cloth covering on sunroof slide panel missing
Headliner water stained from someone having left the sunroof in the vent position while it rained
Engine had a slight miss, and was down on power (I figure the fuel filter to be a good bit of the problem)
These are the high points:
Tires showed nice, even wear
Brakes were new
Catalyst, mid pipe, and ler all new
VERY minor paint chips
All alloy wheels in nice shape, with no clearcoat checking, crazing, clouding or peeling.
Worst rust I found was on the rear sway bar, the car was very nice underneath
Carpets were in nice shape, no real wear, only very minor stains
No evidence of a sunroof leak or water intrusion
Door hinges were sound, and in good alignment
Everything worked except the EQ power button, and the chme module, this includes all windows, locks, seats, sunroof, power antenna, frigid air conditioning, you name it.
Engine oil and dipstick looked very nice
Recent tune up and ignition module replacement
But the largest issue I found with this car, and it will keep me from buying ANY automatic Thunderbird or Cougar.....my size 14 double wide foot gets caught under the brake as I press the accelerator.
Gentlemen, I want to thank you again for helping me with this!
Tim
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Haystack on September 28, 2017, 01:07:45 AM
Post by: Haystack on September 28, 2017, 01:07:45 AM
In 6'5 and I wear size 15, so I know exactly what you mean. I drive with my foot sideways, pivoting at the heel. That way it sits over the brake. Then I can pivot my foot over and hit the tip of the gas pedal.
Btw, the manual pedals are smaller, but much more cramped. Installing a manual brake pedal would probably be the best fix if you cant drive the way I do.
Btw, the manual pedals are smaller, but much more cramped. Installing a manual brake pedal would probably be the best fix if you cant drive the way I do.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: mcb82gt on September 28, 2017, 08:15:09 PM
Post by: mcb82gt on September 28, 2017, 08:15:09 PM
EQ power button not staying engaged (here's a surprise, right?)
Chime Module pretty much mute (another shocker)
Struts and strut mounts knocking
Steering rack expiring [COLOR="#FF0000"]Expected[/COLOR]
AOD throttle lever bushing recall not done[COLOR="#FF0000"]Simple and cheap[/COLOR]
Transmission fluid showing a high amount of clutch wear[COLOR="#FF0000"]Based off what? Expected dirty fluid[/COLOR]
Front main seal seeping[COLOR="#FF0000"]/For sure expected[/COLOR]
Rear main seal seeping[COLOR="#FF0000"] sure expected[/COLOR]
Transmission pan seeping[COLOR="#FF0000"]Simple fix[/COLOR]
Original 30 year old Ford fuel filter still installed[COLOR="#FF0000"]Was it date coded?[/COLOR]
Driver's seat had two rips, one in a spot that would rip further with time
Cloth covering on sunroof slide panel missing
Headliner water stained from someone having left the sunroof in the vent position while it rained
Engine had a slight miss, and was down on power (I figure the fuel filter to be a good bit of the problem)
Not to be critical, but a lot of that is to be expected for a 30yr old car. I wish you could have got it, instead of someone else potentially butcher and molesting it into worthless. You could cut that brake pedal surface smaller and fit another pedal cover onto it :)
Chime Module pretty much mute (another shocker)
Struts and strut mounts knocking
Steering rack expiring [COLOR="#FF0000"]Expected[/COLOR]
AOD throttle lever bushing recall not done[COLOR="#FF0000"]Simple and cheap[/COLOR]
Transmission fluid showing a high amount of clutch wear[COLOR="#FF0000"]Based off what? Expected dirty fluid[/COLOR]
Front main seal seeping[COLOR="#FF0000"]/For sure expected[/COLOR]
Rear main seal seeping[COLOR="#FF0000"] sure expected[/COLOR]
Transmission pan seeping[COLOR="#FF0000"]Simple fix[/COLOR]
Original 30 year old Ford fuel filter still installed[COLOR="#FF0000"]Was it date coded?[/COLOR]
Driver's seat had two rips, one in a spot that would rip further with time
Cloth covering on sunroof slide panel missing
Headliner water stained from someone having left the sunroof in the vent position while it rained
Engine had a slight miss, and was down on power (I figure the fuel filter to be a good bit of the problem)
Not to be critical, but a lot of that is to be expected for a 30yr old car. I wish you could have got it, instead of someone else potentially butcher and molesting it into worthless. You could cut that brake pedal surface smaller and fit another pedal cover onto it :)
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Haystack on September 29, 2017, 01:31:42 AM
Post by: Haystack on September 29, 2017, 01:31:42 AM
I agree with that. However, it has more problems then my $500 car had. For a $5500 asking price, id expect near perfection. The plus side though, all of thise things are pretty fixable. Body work is expensive as well as rust. It would be a good starting point for a project. I dunno about $5500 good though. Just my $.05.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Tbird232ci on September 29, 2017, 05:10:20 PM
Post by: Tbird232ci on September 29, 2017, 05:10:20 PM
I have to agree. For the 5,550 asking price, the car needs to be mostly perfect. Even for 4,500, I would expect a little bit better.
If you're patient, and really do want one of these, you will find a nicer example for less money. I've seen a few that have come up for sale, and then months later come up for sale again for a cheaper price.
If you're patient, and really do want one of these, you will find a nicer example for less money. I've seen a few that have come up for sale, and then months later come up for sale again for a cheaper price.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: thunderjet302 on September 29, 2017, 10:02:08 PM
Post by: thunderjet302 on September 29, 2017, 10:02:08 PM
I'd have to agree. The car had problems, that are easy/cheap to correct, but for $5500 you shouldn't have to correct some of those issues. Now for $3500-4000 it would have been worth it.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Zorin on October 15, 2017, 12:32:25 AM
Post by: Zorin on October 15, 2017, 12:32:25 AM
Mike,
You make good points. But so do the other two posters behind you. Just to clarify a bit:
The fuel filter - the general dingy appearance coupled with "Motorcraft E7XX-XXXXX-XX" told me all I needed to see. An aftermarket Motorcraft filter normally carries a Motorcraft P/N, not a Ford P/N.
The transmission clutch material - when I wipe a dipstick on a white cloth, and get a dark black streak....that's too much clutch material floating around. I already know to expect a nice little pile in the pan.
AOD bushing recall not done - What else did they neglect? This car was supposed to be owned by a VERY meticulous old man.
Transmission pan seeping - yeah, it's minor. But I also went to FULLY inspect the car.
Front main seeping - I'm not adverse to turning a wrench, but this is not acceptable to me at this price point.
Rear main seeping - I'm not pulling an engine or a trans on a car THIS high over market value to fix this.
Struts and steering rack knocking/expiring - This shows a general lack of maintenance, and that is concerning, once again, for a car that was "meticulously maintained".
As best I can determine, that car is worth somewhere in the $3700 neighborhood. At almost two grand higher, I expected better maintenance, and less labor intensive issues to sort at that price point, lest we forget some of the other issues I found - like the interior issues. If I had to throw a dart, I'd say, all in, with everything fixed, including the interior you're talking another couple grand. I also wasn't certain it would even make the trip back to Wichita on the tires it was wearing, or the coolant in it.
Also, I posted all of that just in case someone else runs across this car, hopefully, they find this thread, and can review my inspection to help their buying decision....it is on that basis, I left out NOTHING.
Tim
You make good points. But so do the other two posters behind you. Just to clarify a bit:
The fuel filter - the general dingy appearance coupled with "Motorcraft E7XX-XXXXX-XX" told me all I needed to see. An aftermarket Motorcraft filter normally carries a Motorcraft P/N, not a Ford P/N.
The transmission clutch material - when I wipe a dipstick on a white cloth, and get a dark black streak....that's too much clutch material floating around. I already know to expect a nice little pile in the pan.
AOD bushing recall not done - What else did they neglect? This car was supposed to be owned by a VERY meticulous old man.
Transmission pan seeping - yeah, it's minor. But I also went to FULLY inspect the car.
Front main seeping - I'm not adverse to turning a wrench, but this is not acceptable to me at this price point.
Rear main seeping - I'm not pulling an engine or a trans on a car THIS high over market value to fix this.
Struts and steering rack knocking/expiring - This shows a general lack of maintenance, and that is concerning, once again, for a car that was "meticulously maintained".
As best I can determine, that car is worth somewhere in the $3700 neighborhood. At almost two grand higher, I expected better maintenance, and less labor intensive issues to sort at that price point, lest we forget some of the other issues I found - like the interior issues. If I had to throw a dart, I'd say, all in, with everything fixed, including the interior you're talking another couple grand. I also wasn't certain it would even make the trip back to Wichita on the tires it was wearing, or the coolant in it.
Also, I posted all of that just in case someone else runs across this car, hopefully, they find this thread, and can review my inspection to help their buying decision....it is on that basis, I left out NOTHING.
Tim
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: Moonmount on October 26, 2017, 12:43:54 PM
Post by: Moonmount on October 26, 2017, 12:43:54 PM
Quote from: Zorin;463277
Mike,
You make good points. But so do the other two posters behind you. Just to clarify a bit:
The fuel filter - the general dingy appearance coupled with "Motorcraft E7XX-XXXXX-XX" told me all I needed to see. An aftermarket Motorcraft filter normally carries a Motorcraft P/N, not a Ford P/N.
The transmission clutch material - when I wipe a dipstick on a white cloth, and get a dark black streak....that's too much clutch material floating around. I already know to expect a nice little pile in the pan.
AOD bushing recall not done - What else did they neglect? This car was supposed to be owned by a VERY meticulous old man.
Transmission pan seeping - yeah, it's minor. But I also went to FULLY inspect the car.
Front main seeping - I'm not adverse to turning a wrench, but this is not acceptable to me at this price point.
Rear main seeping - I'm not pulling an engine or a trans on a car THIS high over market value to fix this.
Struts and steering rack knocking/expiring - This shows a general lack of maintenance, and that is concerning, once again, for a car that was "meticulously maintained".
As best I can determine, that car is worth somewhere in the $3700 neighborhood. At almost two grand higher, I expected better maintenance, and less labor intensive issues to sort at that price point, lest we forget some of the other issues I found - like the interior issues. If I had to throw a dart, I'd say, all in, with everything fixed, including the interior you're talking another couple grand. I also wasn't certain it would even make the trip back to Wichita on the tires it was wearing, or the coolant in it.
Also, I posted all of that just in case someone else runs across this car, hopefully, they find this thread, and can review my inspection to help their buying decision....it is on that basis, I left out NOTHING.
Tim
If your looking for a clean car your best bet is to get one from a desert state.
Title: Brand new member - looking for advice on an upcoming purchase.
Post by: mcb82gt on October 30, 2017, 06:14:32 PM
Post by: mcb82gt on October 30, 2017, 06:14:32 PM
Quote from: Zorin;463277
Mike,
You make good points. But so do the other two posters behind you. Just to clarify a bit:
The fuel filter - the general dingy appearance coupled with "Motorcraft E7XX-XXXXX-XX" told me all I needed to see. An aftermarket Motorcraft filter normally carries a Motorcraft P/N, not a Ford P/N.
The transmission clutch material - when I wipe a dipstick on a white cloth, and get a dark black streak....that's too much clutch material floating around. I already know to expect a nice little pile in the pan.
AOD bushing recall not done - What else did they neglect? This car was supposed to be owned by a VERY meticulous old man.
Transmission pan seeping - yeah, it's minor. But I also went to FULLY inspect the car.
Front main seeping - I'm not adverse to turning a wrench, but this is not acceptable to me at this price point.
Rear main seeping - I'm not pulling an engine or a trans on a car THIS high over market value to fix this.
Struts and steering rack knocking/expiring - This shows a general lack of maintenance, and that is concerning, once again, for a car that was "meticulously maintained".
As best I can determine, that car is worth somewhere in the $3700 neighborhood. At almost two grand higher, I expected better maintenance, and less labor intensive issues to sort at that price point, lest we forget some of the other issues I found - like the interior issues. If I had to throw a dart, I'd say, all in, with everything fixed, including the interior you're talking another couple grand. I also wasn't certain it would even make the trip back to Wichita on the tires it was wearing, or the coolant in it.
Also, I posted all of that just in case someone else runs across this car, hopefully, they find this thread, and can review my inspection to help their buying decision....it is on that basis, I left out NOTHING.
Tim
I agree with you. For that price, that car should have been very well kept up, clean wise and service hx wise. I was hoping it would turn out nice and someone would get it that could appreciate and take care of it. I love that color combo.
I think it is down to $4500 now.