Print Page - Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 24, 2011, 01:17:05 PM

O.K., I swapped the heater core Saturday, and before that, all was great in the world. Today, for the fist time, I drove the Sport to take my son to school. About two blocks from the house, the car just died. Nothing, no power at all anywhere. I stopped, checked under the hood, all looked fine. Got in, and then it started right up. NOW, my outer two tail light bulbs on the passenger side won't come on for signals or flashers, but will come on for head lights.

I looked at the filaments, they look fine. I turned on the signals, and looked at the "non-working" bulbs, and they have the tiniest little illumination to them. The driver side is fine, the front lights are fine, and they come on fine with the headlights. Only the outer two bulbs on the rear passenger side..

ALSO, the tiny light bulb that plugs into the headlight switch surround comes on when I turn on the emergency flashers.....is it supposed to do that?

I installed my spare (new) ignition switch, no change. I installed a spare signal light switch, no change. I'm looking around the wires under the column and fuse panel, and can't find anything that looks wrong. My tester light is MIA, so, I'm trouble shooting the best I can right now. I also replaced the bulbs with no changes. It's like there's little to nothing go to those two bulbs for flashers and signals.

I hope the module for the sequentials isn't going bad, but it was fine Friday. That may be it though.

ANY IDEAS ???

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: stangman_1987 on October 24, 2011, 01:29:57 PM

Maybe check all the grounds? I'm not sure, just a thought.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Dan B. on October 24, 2011, 01:36:25 PM

Quote from: stangman_1987;370930

Maybe check all the grounds? I'm not sure, just a thought.

That was my thought also.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 24, 2011, 02:07:47 PM

All the grounds look good. Can't seem to pin point it. The driver side signals are perfect. The inner most passenger side is great. The other two....nope.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Shadow on October 24, 2011, 03:52:25 PM

could be the sequential module.. but that'd be the least of my worries if the car just randomly died, lost all power and poof, started right back up lol i would check the wires from the module to see what kind of voltage you're getting, you could just have super py bulb sockets.. i've replaced those stupid things more times than i've done tune-ups

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 24, 2011, 03:54:10 PM

Adding this. The turn signals work when I turn them on (except for the two outer bulbs on the rear passenger side)......

......BUT, when I turn on the headlights, the right hand little green signal dash light (green arrow) comes on, and All of the rear lights come on, but the passenger side signal lights don't work at all. When I turn the hazard lights on, with the headlights on, all lights are on, the driver side flash as they should, but only the inner most passenger side tail light.

What the is going on?

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 24, 2011, 03:57:19 PM

I think the starting (or I should say "dying") issue was a wire under the column itself that came loose. I fixed that I believe. The lights were fine Friday, and now, not. Two sockets at once sounds crazy. Also, as I stated, the bulbs on the passenger side that aren't flashing have the extreme slightest flash to them, but so weak you can barely see it.

I thought maybe since I pulled the dash back to do the heater core Saturday, maybe a wire was pulled or something. I looked from the fuse panel and can't find any bad wires.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Thunder Chicken on October 24, 2011, 04:05:34 PM

You've probably got a bad ground to the passenger tail light. The turn signals are seeking a ground through the park light circuit, but when you turn on the park lights that ground path disappears and the turn signal isn't working. The park lights are in turn seeking their ground through the turn signals (which is why the green light comes on in the dash)

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 24, 2011, 04:06:38 PM

Where are those grounds?

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 24, 2011, 04:19:44 PM

I HATE electrical stuff.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Soul on October 24, 2011, 05:11:23 PM

x2 on the grounds, had one bad in my old truck, hit breaks would blink or do other random things, hit blinker and more different random things. Trying to ground back through circuit making odd things happen.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Shadow on October 24, 2011, 05:39:41 PM

factory wiring is much more complicated than it needs to be.. they made it harder to deal with, so that when you had issues, you would take your car to a dealership

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 24, 2011, 06:30:01 PM

All of the wires in the trunk look good. Connections are solid. No loose wires anywhere.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 24, 2011, 06:44:21 PM

I think it may be the sequencer. I'm going back out to look again............

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 24, 2011, 07:05:44 PM

......O.K., I just noticed, that with the headlights off, and the passenger side signal on, the little green dash indicator blinks (as it should), and the speedo light is blinking. What the ? Is there a ground behind the gauges? Maybe something got "moved" or whatever when I pulled the dash for the heater core. Where do I start? I looked at the wires above the fuse block and couldn't see anything wrong...in the 34 bazillion wires...... I'll pull the gauge cluster and all tomorrow to see what I can see.

If any of you have ANY ideas where to start or what I'm looking for, let me know. For example, locations, wire colors, etc. I hate electrical .

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: The Shredder on October 24, 2011, 07:23:43 PM

Vinnie, there are NO grounds behind the gauge pod. Do not pull that.

The running lights are searching for a ground. The only grounds at the dash are on either side of the radio center section. And you didn't disconnect those.

Check all your fuses.

Your dash is grounded to the chassis at the bolted connection points

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 24, 2011, 07:26:59 PM

Fuses? I'll check them after work tomorrow. I'll double check the grounds at the dash/radio center area. I have everything else working fine. Just those friggin lights.If you guys have ANY other ideas, pass them along. I gotta get this fixed. Thanks a lot for the help.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 24, 2011, 07:37:20 PM

Those two grounds are intact. Is there a wire at the fuse block to double check? Here's my list of what I checked...

signal switch
ignition switch
Pulled fuse block down and didn't see anything wrong...maybe I missed something
Bulbs front and rear
Wires to the rear bulbs
Wire connections (that I can see and find (apparently I'm missing something or this would be fixed)
Bulb sockets.

and no electrical place in this town.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: The Shredder on October 24, 2011, 07:51:30 PM

My jeep did funny light things after I hooked up a trailer with screwed up lights wiring and no good ground. Even after disconnecting the trailer, all my interior lights would blink when signals were on. It was just a blown fuse.

Also, there may be a pinched wire somewhere. Check by the pedal assembly and the sides of the dash.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 24, 2011, 08:01:59 PM

I'll check there as well. Keep the ideas coming. This is one of those little things that will bug me in my sleep. Whoever comes up with the right idea, I'll send them a free gift.....really.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: cougarman on October 24, 2011, 08:32:33 PM

Try grounding the pass. taillight with it's own ground. :)

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 24, 2011, 08:58:15 PM

Re-ground it? meaning, tap into the current ground, and ground the light twice?

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: cougarman on October 24, 2011, 09:23:14 PM

Yes.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: 5.0 tbird on October 24, 2011, 09:37:48 PM

Here's my 2 cents, my car was doing the exact same thing. When I turned the left signal on it would cause my speedo to blink on and off; it was also doing it when I put on the brakes.

Guess what it ended up being? One of the BRAND NEW taillight bulbs I put in the day before was shorted from the factory. I swapped the bulbs to the other taillight, and the problem moved to the other side... One new bulb and the problem was solved.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Shadow on October 24, 2011, 09:39:52 PM

if that doesn't do the trick, it has to be the module.. just remembered my sonoma did the same thing with the signal indicator when the ground was off the rad support on the front.. my bulbs won't light at all though.. maybe your sequential ground is weak and that's why you're only getting 1 fully lit and the other 2 very dimly lit?

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 24, 2011, 10:59:29 PM

The other two lights aren't doing anything now.

I swapped the bulbs from the driver side to the passenger side. No dice. Same two lights out.

Seems like a strange coincidence that after I move the dash that this starts.

I'll try the grounding idea, and re-do the ground for the sequentials. It may be the sequencer, we'll see. More troubleshooting and updates tomorrow.

I can't help but think it's something under/behind the dash or fuse block.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: stangman_1987 on October 25, 2011, 03:37:07 AM

Try running some jumper wires to the body of your car from the bulb sockets. I'm not sure on the color of the wire. Possibly black?

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: TOM Renzo on October 25, 2011, 06:11:37 AM

Ok Vin

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 25, 2011, 06:57:37 AM

I'll check the dash area the best I can. I hope I don't have to pull the dash again, but may have to. I'll pull the front panels of the dash and see if I can find anything through there. I only unplugged two plugs on the passenger side, and they went back together. I didn't disconnect anything from the driver side. maybe something got smashed or twisted or whatever when I put the dash back in place.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 25, 2011, 07:17:14 AM

Update before I leave for work.......

With the headlights off (its dark here), and the right signal on, the gauge lights, systems sentry,and a/c panel lights blink. With the headlights on, they don't. Crazy.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Soul on October 25, 2011, 09:20:19 AM

On the left side by kick panel fuse area there is a ground that I think is for fuse or headlight switch not sure which.

And guessing but by glove box isn't there a blue relay for blinkers?

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: stangman_1987 on October 25, 2011, 12:18:08 PM

Quote from: vinnietbird;370992

Re-ground it? meaning, tap into the current ground, and ground the light twice?

Cougar I didn't see this before I posted my .02, but that is exactly what I meant.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: TOM Renzo on October 25, 2011, 12:24:27 PM

Thats a back feed in

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: TOM Renzo on October 25, 2011, 12:27:20 PM

ould assume.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Haystack on October 25, 2011, 01:36:33 PM

If you pinched a positive wire, say around the colum, it might not be enough to blow a fuse, but it might be enough to give you the effect of a bad ground. I would test around your colum and dash with a test light or multi meter, for voltage.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 25, 2011, 04:17:27 PM

I'm thinking it's in the dash area. I'm going to pull the dash panels and gauge cluster (super easy stuff), then start looking for every wire I can possibly see. If I have to, I'll yank the "bleepin'" dash Friday morning and do it that way.

I really appreciate you guys, and thanks Tom for the list. I'll be using it.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: hwy73 on October 25, 2011, 04:30:50 PM

Vinnie, did you say you pulled a seat when you did the heater core? Maybe one of those grounds under the seat got pinched/knocked loose.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: flylear45 on October 25, 2011, 05:25:37 PM

I agree with all Tom has said on this one. I am thinking a connector or something got jarred loose when you did the dash. When stuff messes up after I do work I concentrate on that area first.

I had a single connection bad in a 4 wire connector that gave me fits on mine. It may be something like that here.

Keep at it and you'll get it.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 25, 2011, 06:21:42 PM

Yeah, as soon as I have time, either Thursday after work, or Friday morning, I'm yanking it all from the front of the dash for easier access to what I can reach. I'll get a flash light and look for everything and anything, and See what I can see. man, i hope it's simple. I'm sure it is.....or not.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 25, 2011, 06:27:08 PM

Quote from: hwy73;371085

Vinnie, did you say you pulled a seat when you did the heater core? Maybe one of those grounds under the seat got pinched/knocked loose.

I'll double check, but I doubt it's there. Nothing is out of the realm of possibility though. I just have a gut feeling it's within the regions of the dash.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Chrome on October 25, 2011, 08:19:08 PM

Vinnie, all indications are of a ground issue. The dash is the best place to look for problems because you just worked there. Low voltage can cause modules to freak. I don't know electrical system of these birds well yet, but I don't know of any modules in the tail light system other than your seqential. If all else fails, check voltage there. Module could be bad also. Re-grounding the sockets is an exellent idea for diagnostic purposes. I can't wait to see the results of this test. All other responses to your delema are much better than what I had to say. This advice is for if you are just grasping for straws.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 25, 2011, 10:58:58 PM

All responses are great. I will keep listening to every idea out there, and I'll make sure to post what I find when I find it (not IF, but "when").

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 26, 2011, 06:47:28 AM

Dropping the column as my first plan of attack either this evening, or after work tomorrow. After that....well, we'll see what happens.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: 88 Blackbird 5.0 on October 26, 2011, 12:51:01 PM

Vinnie, there's a ground over by the ECM that I'll bet you forgot to reconnect. For the car to die like it did, something more important than the ground for a light circuit has to be faulty. Pull your passenger side kick panel and have a look.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 26, 2011, 04:35:02 PM

The stalling problem seems to be gone. I had a yellow wire loose under the column. I will check at the kick panel though. I'm HOPING that one more wire under the column is loose or something. I'd like this to be a small issue, and simple to find.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: flylear45 on October 26, 2011, 06:50:55 PM

Also, re-check the 3-4 plugs over top of the fuse panel. Lots of electrical goodness gets to the body from there. Make sure the clips are fully seated.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 26, 2011, 07:27:18 PM

I'll check those as well. I'm still taking any more ideas. I'm going to re-read all of this, take more notes, and hit it Friday morning after I drop my son off at school. reports to follow, of course.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: CatManDude on October 26, 2011, 07:48:30 PM

There should be a ground "strap" around the lamp socket. Most of the ground wires are black, too. Sounds like a bad ground, but maybe a short is possible, too. You could disconnect the battery and try an ohm meter between the positive terminal of one of the failing bulbs and a grounded screw on the chassis. If you get zero ohms or close, that may be the problem. You could also check for a bad ground the same way between a screw and the lamp negative post...if you don't get zero or close that may be the problem. Or, you can confirm that you have voltage at the lamp by using a test light grounded to the chassis and probe the positive terminal of the lamp socket. I'm also wondering if a wire may have gotten pinched or penetrated by a screw when you were reassembling things after the heater core job, and I believe that some of the wiring for the lights passes beneath the steering column, so check where you found that other wiring problem and there may be another issue under there. I am wondering if your flasher relay is causing this somehow, which would be a cheap fix. I have some wiring diagrams and troubleshooting procedures and diagrams that I can scan and email to you, if you like. Not sure if I can attach them to a private message, so I may need to email you.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: CatManDude on October 26, 2011, 07:49:23 PM

you would need the battery connected for the test light to work, by the way.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 26, 2011, 10:48:02 PM

Thanks a lot. The more I think about it, the more I truly think it's around the column. I THOUGHT the steering wheel was resting on the driver seat when I lowered it, but apparently, it was hanging. Not like me to let that kind of thing happen, so, maybe a wire was pulled, also, right above the column, but under the dash, there's a harness. I'll start there.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 28, 2011, 02:13:27 PM

Alright, I have everything pulled, console, dash, seats......I have looked at every wire I can possible see and can't find any sign of breaks, damage, or anything else that looks hinky. I don't know where to look from here. There are a LOT of wires. Everything seems in order. I just find it funny that this happened as soon as I did the heater core. I swapped the dash after swapping the fuse panel last year with zero issues. Everything worded as it should, and has since I did the core swap. I have to get the old girl back together shortly. Gotta have the car. I am at a loss on this.

Also, it just gets me that when the headlights are OFF, and I turn the right side signal lights on, the gauges,a/c control panel and Sentry panel all flash as well with the signal. Nothing like that happens on the driver side. The radio and clock are unaffected. I checked the fuses, and they are good as well.

The wires from the signal switch to as far as I can get to seem in place, seated in the plugs and in good shape.

And, why would the inner rear passenger side light work great, but the outer two won't at all? I would think that the inner light would affected somehow as well.

I'm NOT an electrician by any stretch of the imagination. Lost on this.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: The Shredder on October 28, 2011, 03:26:01 PM

Replace your flasher?

I'm at a loss on this one too. But the outer two lights are the brake/turn signal lights normally. So do the brake lights work fine? Does the sentry and others flash when brakes are applied?

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 28, 2011, 04:01:01 PM

When the brakes are applied, all of the tail lights work as they should. The dash lights only "signal" when I turn on the passenger side signal when the headlights are off.

When the head lights are on, there are no gauge ,sentry,a/c lights.

I swapped the head light switch a minute ago. Getting ready to see if that made a difference.

I'm JUST getting the interior back together. I need the car at 3:45. Getting ready to see if anything made a difference or not, or, if it's time to sell the Sport. This electrical won't cut it with me. Yes, as much as I love the car, I'd let the Sport go to a new home for that alone. I'll give it a little time, but I need dash lights at dark hours, and signals for safety.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Soul on October 28, 2011, 04:04:12 PM

Start where this stuff is all connected and move out?
Just brainstorming but.

Light switch and relays
Blinker switch in column

I have a similiar issue where My inside lights are wonky and only one blinker worked. I changed ign switch and blinker switch at same time and it was better.
Mine had caught fire previously though.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 28, 2011, 04:19:38 PM

I swapped the ignition switch, signal switch, and signal relay at the fuse panel.

Now, the green light for the passenger side signal (in the gauge cluster) isn't coming on. It did that when I first noticed earlier in the week, then it magically came on, although the tail lights are still doing the same thing.

I started at the signal light switch on the column, and traced the wires as far as I could see them, no damage anywhere, all the wires are tight in their plugs.

I had the cluster out, all the bulbs are good, and the back of the cluster looks great as well.

I have only visually checked the bulb sockets. They are dry, no corrosion or damage.

I took the driver side bulbs and swapped them with the passenger side bulbs. Bulbs are good, still no blinky on the passenger side.

I'll get an emergency light flasher and swap it, but technically, it works. When I pull the flasher switch, they blink, only the two outer bulbs don't. All the rest do.

I have the sequential lights in the rear, but even if the sequencer was weird, it seems like it wouldn't affect the dash lights.

Everything is plugged in and where it should be no bare wires at all that I can trace and see.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: 5.0 tbird on October 28, 2011, 04:37:12 PM

These are thoughts I have while looking at your problem.

Have you put a voltmeter on the wires going to the taillights bulbs that don't flash?

Have you checked the voltage at the turn signal switch for the passenger side signals?

The reason your gauge lights are blinking is because voltage is feeding back through the turn signal indicator in the cluster. The climate control panel lights I dunno unless they're on the same circuit as the gauge lights. They might be.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Shadow on October 28, 2011, 04:56:31 PM

i hate wiring more than anyone else, but i wouldn't let a wiring issue separate me from a car i put so much work into, like you have with the sport

but something tells me your sequential box took a .. if it's not grounding correctly, it could send backfeed and make your signal lights search for a ground elsewhere

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: TOM Renzo on October 28, 2011, 05:51:03 PM

Vinnie c

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: TOM Renzo on October 28, 2011, 06:20:01 PM

OK di

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 28, 2011, 07:17:55 PM

Tom, all of the driver side lights are functioning properly.

All of the front lights are working as they should as well.

I checked every plug I could find for loose wires or being unplugged.

The third brake light in the rear window seems to be working fine also.

The dash lights (gauges,sentry,a/c panels) only blink with the signals when the headlights are turned OFF. When the headlights are turned on, the dash lights all go out when they should illuminate.

.When you say "pull the signal bulbs", do you mean the tail lights bulbs? And "put the dims on"...What do you mean by that? Dim head lights?

.........O.K., just checked the lights. The second filaments on either bulb (the two outer lights on the passenger side) don't come on at all. Not with the headlights on or off, not with the brake lights on, nothing.

The two outer lights DO come on with the head lights, but not brakes. The inner most light is the one I added for the sequentials per the instructions that came with them. It works fine.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Thunder Chicken on October 28, 2011, 07:23:55 PM

One remote possibility: One of the right side tail light sockets is shorted between the park and stop/turn circuits. This could cause the turn signal circuit to backfeed into the park lamp circuit, which is also connected to the dash light circuit. I actually saw this happen one time on a Saab 9000, where the car's owner forced an 1156 (single filament) bulb into an 1157 (dual filament) socket. The single connector on the bottom of the bulb was shorting the two terminals inside the socket together, causing the dash lights to come on every time the brake pedal was pressed. What made this particular car even more intriguing was that when you shut the car off with your foot on the brake it would continue running until you released the brake. The brake light circuit was energizing the park lights, which were energizing the daytime running lights, which was energizing the IGN circuit, which was keeping the fuel and spark coming. Everything was relay driven, else that small short would have almost certainly have caused a fire had those park light wires been called on to power up all of that...

...But I digress. I say "Remote" possibility because in theory, if the two contacts were shorting together in your car you should see your park lights come on too with the turn signals, not just the dash lights. In theory. Still, it's something to check.

One thing is certain: The sequencer unit is not causing your grief. The sequencer is not connected to the park light side of things and therefore cannot turn them on, nor can it backfeed into any other circuit it's not connected to (such as the dash lights). If there is a short in one of the sockets and the sequencer is forced to feed the park lights externally (IE the problem is in a socket, not the sequencer) it might, just might, have overloaded the SCR's in the sequencer and popped them. This would be a case of the problem causing the sequencer's death, not the sequencer's death causing the problem. The SCR's are rated at 10 amps continuous, 25 peak, so chances are slim that they were popped though. The fact that the brake lights are working kinda points toward the SCR's being OK though, since the brake lights are fed by them (the sequencer does not know whether it's getting power from the turn signal switch or the brake light switch, it just lights up the bulbs)...

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 28, 2011, 07:38:26 PM

When the brake pedal is pushed, the driver side sequences out as it should. The third brake light comes on, but only the inner most light on the passenger side (The one I added for the sequencer). The outer two lights do not illuminate.

NOW, thanks a lot guys for the help here. I don't read wiring diagrams, and sadly, have to be spoken to like a 6 year old when it comes to this .

For the person who ends up directing me to the cure, I'm sending a nice gift to you.........seriously.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Thunder Chicken on October 28, 2011, 07:50:42 PM

Ok, but the park lights don't come on with the brake lights or right turn signal, right? Just the dash lights? Did you look at the front lights?

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Shadow on October 28, 2011, 07:52:30 PM

hmm.. take a test light to the side of the sequencer that leads to the signal switch (the 'IN' lead).. that should tell you if it's your sequential box for the passenger side or not.. if it's still dead with the flashers on, you know your problem is elsewhere and not in the sequencer or the tail light sockets. if it does illuminate and flash, your sequencer is either shot or the ground is weak

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 28, 2011, 08:06:32 PM

The parking lights don't come on. All of the 6 front lights are working as they should. I did notice, even the little light that illuminates the headlight switch panel blinks with the dash lights when the signal is turned on for the passenger side (while the head lights are off).

Shadow...I have to go get a test light this weekend. I have to admit, I've never used one before.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 28, 2011, 08:26:02 PM

By the way, I also tried swapping the head light switch........no change.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Shadow on October 28, 2011, 08:26:34 PM

say whaaaaaaaaaaaat? lol a hands-on car guy that's never used a test light? HOLY lol

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on October 28, 2011, 08:34:48 PM

Yep, it's sad, but true. I gotta figure this out.....apparently with a lot of help. I just don't get it. Was it from the heater core swap and something got jacked up? Or was it a coincidence? It's driving me nuts. Everything else on the Sport is working just fine.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: TOM Renzo on October 28, 2011, 09:23:54 PM

No what i mean is by DIMS is the parking lights. We call them DIMS. Old expression. Pull all the tail lights out from the sockets that are signal related then see if the dash does the same thing. hang tight i am going to bring up all data. You do have an 86 correct???

Ok check this out. It is time to get down and dig in to this trouble. Use an old fashion test light not a circuit safe one. Connect it to a good ground and turn on the headlights. Check for battery at fuse F13 5A. Is their battery on both sides of the fuse??? If yes you have a bad ground at location G902 Does the console light work??? If not you have a bad ground at G206. Check that out and post back. Thanks

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Post by: Shadow on October 28, 2011, 09:27:09 PM

86? his sport is an 88 lol

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Post by: TOM Renzo on October 28, 2011, 09:55:44 PM

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Post by: TOM Renzo on October 28, 2011, 09:56:58 PM

Ok i

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Post by: The Shredder on October 28, 2011, 10:19:04 PM

Vinnie, your car is paying you back for doing one too many frontal lobotomies (intake swaps). :)

Hang in there. You'll figure it out. If not, I'll swap you cars. You can fix my slight miss.

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Post by: Kitz Kat on October 28, 2011, 11:25:09 PM

Vinnie, since you lowered the steering column, it's about the only thing that could affect whats going on. You also need a test light. There must be a plug coming out of the column,I would look there.
Did you try to move the handle of the turn signal around some? a little father a little less,see if anything flashes on that side?

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Post by: vinnietbird on October 29, 2011, 07:09:02 AM

Tom, the console storage light doesn't blink like the rest of the lights on the dash, BUT, the ash tray light (under the console control panel) does blink like the dash lights when the signal is on. I'll check the wires under the console control panel...as far as using the test light, I'll get one, and experiment. Never owned one. No need til now.LOL.

I have to get a test light, don't have one yet.

.....Kitz, I Haven't tried to move the signal lever except on and off. I checked the plugs, made sure the wires were pushed in tightly in the plugs, couldn't find any sign of pulled wires, etc. I'll check that after work again.

Gotta go to work right now. Back later and hopefully we can all get this figured out.

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Post by: EricCoolCats on October 29, 2011, 09:01:53 AM

Well, may as well chime in...

The turn signal blinking the dash lights--that's happened to me before, twice. First time it was a power feedback from too much voltage running through the car after it got jump started during the winter. Second time it was due to the infamous pinched wire (light blue/red) behind the radio after a new radio was installed.

The dash light circuit from 1985-88 is split into two parts coming out of the fuse panel. One (fuse #4) is responsible for most of the dash lights and the clock/heater panel IIRC; the other (fuse #13) takes care of the other part of the dash, PLUS the lighter panel and console light (if one has a console).

So what Vinnie describes is almost consistent with power feeding back to that one wire.
It kind of all traces back to that...it may simply be a bad fuse.

Although I tend to agree with Kitz, and that it sounds like a grounding issue.

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Post by: TOM Renzo on October 29, 2011, 01:08:35 PM

GOOD t

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Post by: TOM Renzo on October 29, 2011, 01:18:50 PM

Eric fu

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Post by: Thunder Chicken on October 29, 2011, 03:00:50 PM

The headlights in these cars are not fused through the fuse panel, they're fed through a fusible link and also have a circuit breaker inside the headlight switch. This feed wire is a large gauge black one with orange stripe. This feed wire does also feed certain fuses in the panel (including fuse 4), but it is not protected by any of these fuses. You could remove every fuse in the panel and your headlights will still work.

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Post by: vinnietbird on October 29, 2011, 04:23:10 PM

I'm going to get a light right now. Stay tuned.

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Post by: vinnietbird on October 29, 2011, 05:09:44 PM

O.K....I have a test light. Now, how do I test the fuse? How do I test the wires at the ash tray light under the console control panel (I know I have to pull the panel, but then what?)?

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Post by: TOM Renzo on October 29, 2011, 05:41:33 PM

Thund

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Post by: TOM Renzo on October 29, 2011, 05:43:46 PM

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Post by: Thunder Chicken on October 29, 2011, 06:06:38 PM

Not a problem, Tom. I've got Mitchell On Demand and it's not exactly clear either. Newer vehicles have wonderful wiring diagrams, but anything older than 1993 or so is horrible...

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Post by: TOM Renzo on October 29, 2011, 06:43:13 PM

Than

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Post by: vinnietbird on October 29, 2011, 06:44:01 PM

Tom, I'm going to try it right now. I am doing something new, so hang tight. I'll be back in a few minutes.

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Post by: vinnietbird on October 29, 2011, 06:49:09 PM

O.K., there's a blue wire and a black wire to the socket. The blue wire side flashed with the tester, the black wire side did not.

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Post by: Shadow on October 29, 2011, 06:49:14 PM

someone nees a laptop.. LOL

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Post by: vinnietbird on October 29, 2011, 06:50:06 PM

By the way.WOO-HOOO !!!!!! I used a test light for the first time !!!!!!!!!!!

Now, back on topic.......

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Post by: TOM Renzo on October 29, 2011, 07:17:21 PM

Ok go

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Post by: vinnietbird on October 29, 2011, 07:20:25 PM

What does "back probe it" mean?

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Post by: vinnietbird on October 29, 2011, 07:28:49 PM

Quote from: TOM Renzo;371457

Ok go to fuse 13 and back probe it does it flash their with the headlights ON ??? Or does it flash with the signal on right turn???

Blue wire flashing!!! That means the ground is OK.

Give me a little more detail Tom. You want me to check it with the headlights on and the signal on? Then headlights off with the signal on?

Also, I'm not sure what back probing is.

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Post by: TOM Renzo on October 29, 2011, 07:42:03 PM

Well

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Post by: vinnietbird on October 29, 2011, 08:24:52 PM

Tom, I'll do that first thing tomorrow after work. It's dark here, so I'm out of luck. I left the console panel apart, and will let you know what happens right after work. I never knew the fuses had small holes in them for testing. New to me, and I've changed a lot of them, guess I never paid any attention. Fuse 13, got it.

I appreciate you guys a lot.

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Post by: TOM Renzo on October 29, 2011, 09:40:45 PM

reall

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Post by: vinnietbird on October 30, 2011, 06:45:11 AM

Tom, I'm in nursing care. We take care of Veterans long term. We are between a hospital and a nursing home. Long term care facility. Guys from their 20's up past 100 years old. I've been there over 18 years.

On the Sport's issue, I am hoping, that with yo guys helping, we'll figure it out. I'll be here around 3:15 or so with the results of the fuse 13 check. It's really driving my crazy.

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Post by: vinnietbird on October 30, 2011, 05:06:54 PM

Alright....I checked the fuse (it was blown, I replaced it), and the test light blinked through the fuse with the headlights turned OFF. When I turned the headlights on, the test light glows steady, no blinking when the signal is on.

Now what? Ugh !!!!

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Post by: vinnietbird on October 31, 2011, 01:35:01 PM

Any ideas?

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Post by: Soul on October 31, 2011, 02:30:30 PM

Young Priest and Old Priest?

I'd start removing things from the circuit IE bulbs, relays or whatever and work my way in. Remove non essential stuff and see if it starts behaving. So far this is odd.

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Post by: Soul on October 31, 2011, 02:31:54 PM

Also side thought, i don't get why your blinker is messing with the gauge lighting. Still makes me think ground but you checked everything. Do you have an EVTM for your car? If not I can maybe scan some stuff out of mine if you want.

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Post by: vinnietbird on October 31, 2011, 04:23:38 PM

I get lost reading those. Electrical just isn't my thing. I don't understand it either. I pulled the console control panel, and can't find an issue. Weird stuff happening. No dash lights when I turn on the head lights, signal working the dash lights with the head light switch off...etc.... Just weird.

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Post by: stangman_1987 on October 31, 2011, 05:32:37 PM

Vinnie.. try this. Splice into one of the black wires connected to a bulb receptacle that is dim. Then, with the wire you spliced with, get a good contact with the body. Say maybe the trunk latch. Turn on your signals and hold the wire on to give it good contact.. see if the light get brighter. Try this and let us know.

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Post by: vinnietbird on October 31, 2011, 05:46:06 PM

O.K., I'll try it. hang tight for the results...........

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Post by: vinnietbird on October 31, 2011, 05:51:46 PM

Nope, no dice. No change. No signals. Man, am at a loss. Obviously, it HAS to be something.

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Post by: stangman_1987 on October 31, 2011, 07:47:42 PM

Dang, maybe do the same with a gtond fron one of the dash light receptacles? Also do you have a ground going ftom your negative battery post to the body of your car. That cant really be it cause the drivers side is fine. I know my old toyota pickup ran like and had dim lights without a body ground. Did you check the wire eric was talking about? I really think Tom was onto something with the dash ground too.

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Post by: vinnietbird on October 31, 2011, 08:02:21 PM

The car runs great. It's just in the dash and passenger side tail light. ...oh, and the center stack except the radio and clock. I'm baffled. It just seems like maybe a wire was .....well...I don't know. I checked what I could see. I'm scratching my head.

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Post by: Chrome on October 31, 2011, 08:21:07 PM

I'll be getting a subscription to ALL DATA on payday. I'm as lost as you are without a wiring diagram. I hope you find your problem by then. I was sure Tom would have found the fix by now. I know he is trying very hard to. Keep being patient and one of us will find something. I think the priest idea is good!

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Post by: vinnietbird on October 31, 2011, 09:52:31 PM

I'm patient, but somewhat anxious. As I've said, fixing any problem with the Sport doesn't bother me. It's when I can't figure it out that kills me. Like most issues here with our cars, as a group, they get fixed. I'm sure the Sport is no exception. This forum is the best ever. Period.

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Post by: Haystack on October 31, 2011, 11:12:25 PM

Hook your test light to the negetive battery terminal, and test all the groundin points of the car, specially around the dash. If a wire is shorting out, it may be "leaking" power. Sometimes this will let you know right where its at, sometimes it won't. At least its something easy to try.

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Post by: Shadow on October 31, 2011, 11:24:15 PM

i still say test the wires sequential box.. lol

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Post by: softtouch on November 01, 2011, 12:44:17 AM

Are these two statements correct?
1.With the headlights off and the right turn signal on, the right front turn signal blinks and the right turn indicator on the dash does not blink.

2. With the headlights off and the left turn signal on, the left front turn signal blinks and the left turn indicator on the dash blinks.

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Post by: Shadow on November 01, 2011, 02:07:11 AM

i know he said the left works perfectly fine in all aspects.. front, rear and the indicator in the cluster all flash as they should

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 01, 2011, 06:54:03 AM

When I get home after work, I'll test the sequential box and try to do the grounds. I need more input on the ground testing though. I still have a feeling it's in the dash somewhere, but no idea what to check.

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Post by: softtouch on November 01, 2011, 04:05:00 PM

The green arrow turn signal on the cluster is powered by the same circuit that powers the front turn signal.
The other lights that are blinking along with the turn signal are powered through the dimmer control and fuse 13.
The dimmer control and fuse 13 only have power when the headlights are on.
The green turn signal indicator and the other blinking lights share the same ground, G902, see diagram below.
Check ground G902.
If it looks good, set up the condition where all the extra lights are blinking with the turn signal.
Ground your test light somewhere other than the dash and probe a hot wire or a fuse to make sure the ground for the light is good.
Probe G902 with the light. If it blinks G902 is not getting to chassis ground.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 01, 2011, 06:30:30 PM

O.K., I'm going to re-read that post and diagram about 10 times and try it tomorrow when the sun is high enough.

Maybe I didn't notice before, maybe it just started, but the clock (tripminder) blinks with the signal light when the headlights are OFF.

If G902 is NOT getting a ground, and it's blinking,would I just ground it somewhere else?

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Post by: softtouch on November 01, 2011, 10:04:08 PM

Quote from: vinnietbird;371695

If G902 is NOT getting a ground, and it's blinking,would I just ground it somewhere else?

G02 is on the dash frame. I don't know if there is supposed to be a ground wire between the dash frame and the chassis or if the mounting screws are supposed to do the job.

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Post by: Shadow on November 01, 2011, 10:10:27 PM

iii think the mounting points are supposed to do the grounding.. very easy to have a weak ground that way.. maybe it'd be a good idea to run a ground from the frame to the chassis somewhere.. but that doesn't really explain why the driver side works fine.. still, it's definitely a possibility

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 01, 2011, 10:22:34 PM

I'll check the grounds again that go to the frame of the dash, and I can try the dash frame ground to the chassis. I may pull the stereo out of the dash and look a little more as well. I'm hoping I don't have to pull the dash AGAIN, but, if I knew what the issue was for certain, I'd yank that be-yotch out in a flash.

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Post by: stangman_1987 on November 01, 2011, 10:57:05 PM

Good luck!

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 01, 2011, 11:03:05 PM

I'm having high hopes and low expectations right about now.

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Post by: Shadow on November 01, 2011, 11:24:17 PM

the best way to attack things like this is to not get your hopes up at every little thing you try.. it crushes you a little each time something doesn't work/fix the problem. it adds to the stress with each letdown

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 01, 2011, 11:27:22 PM

I agree 100%.

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Post by: Shadow on November 02, 2011, 12:46:55 AM

electrical sucks the big 1.. i hope you find the problem soon, i know how stressed you're getting. i've been there before, i think most of us have

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 02, 2011, 12:56:16 AM

I am not starting bodywork until this is resolved. Hey, what happened to Tom?

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 02, 2011, 12:48:51 PM

I did the G902 ground to another spot, and nothing. No change.

When I put the test light to the ground, no blinky.

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Post by: softtouch on November 02, 2011, 01:25:38 PM

Did the dash lights come on with headlights after you replaced the blown fuse 13?
Has fuse 13 blown again since you replaced it?

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 02, 2011, 01:47:33 PM

Good question....I'm going to go check that. Give me two minutes.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 02, 2011, 01:50:26 PM

Yep, it's blown again. Fuse 13.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 02, 2011, 01:54:09 PM

I had pulled the cluster and tried the signal, still the same results.

The radio (cd player) still works as it should as well.

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Post by: softtouch on November 02, 2011, 02:23:49 PM

I afraid it's down to chasing the light blue with red strip wire. It goes from fuse 13 to all over hell's half acre.
Do you have the electronic cluster?
I am using the 87 EVTM, hopefully there there are no differances with the 88 in this area.
I'll see if I can come up with some connectors to unplug to narrow it down.
I hope you have extra fuses.

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Post by: softtouch on November 02, 2011, 02:29:08 PM

Quote from: vinnietbird;371742

I had pulled the cluster and tried the signal, still the same results..

Woops, I skipped over this too fast. So the turn signal is getting tied into the dash lights before it gets to the cluster.
The green turn signal indicator is part of the cluster, right?

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Post by: flylear45 on November 02, 2011, 02:57:13 PM

Well, if you keep blowing fuse 13 you have to isolate the short.

I am not near my manuals to help you, but the idea is to unhook everything and see if the fuse blows. If it doesn't then connect items on the circuit one at a time until the fuse blows. Then fix the bad component or wire section.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 02, 2011, 02:59:41 PM

Any help is well appreciated. I have extra fuses, and can get more. I have the buttstuffog cluster.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 02, 2011, 03:14:32 PM

Unhook everything? Do I have to pull the dash again?

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 02, 2011, 03:15:50 PM

I'll be right back. It may look like I'm gone, but I'm not. Keep the info coming. I appreciate you guys.

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Post by: softtouch on November 02, 2011, 04:27:23 PM

Some connectors to unplug for the LB/R wire from fuse 13.
C288 LH side of fuse panel, black 12 terminal. Pic below.
C308 RH side of IP, gray 2 terminal, clock lamp. Shown in the G902 pic.
C247 At cigar lighter lamp, gray 2 terminal. No pic.
C907 Behind center of IP at the heater A/C control lamp. gray 2 terminal. No pic.
C560 Behind RH side of IP. Graphic equalizer lamp. Gray 8 terminal. No pic.

The right turn signal is a W/LB (white with light blue stripe) wire.
C237 LH side of steering column, Gray 6 terminal.
There are two W/LB wires on the same terminal of C237.
One goes to the cornering lamp relay. pic below (good luck figuring where that is )
The other goes to terminal 16 of C285 on the cluster.
There is a second wire on terminal 16 that goes to C232 at the LH front fender apr0n below the the head lights and from there to the RH front turn signal light.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 02, 2011, 05:47:14 PM

I don't have anti-theft, cornering lights, graphic equalizer,or a moon roof. That has to help.

I'll try unplugging those things one at a time after I install a new fuse. It's raining now......of course.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 02, 2011, 05:56:20 PM

When you refer to "terminal" are you talking fuse location? I can drop the fuse panel fairly easy. Electrical stuff easily confuses me. Honestly, I have to admit, I was looking for another Sport today to donate the current drive train in to and swap bodies, so to speak. That's how much I hate this stuff.

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Post by: softtouch on November 02, 2011, 06:38:32 PM

With terminal I am referring to the wire positions in a connector. A connector that has positions for 6 wires is a 6 terminal connnector.
The cluster connectors have 18 terminals

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 02, 2011, 06:52:45 PM

Aaaaah, I see now. I'll try again tomorrow to find the culprit. Every free day I've had I'm looking. No dice. I've got more time into looking for this elusive wire than I do installing my drivetrain into this car...and a few different intakes.....and the heater core swap.

I will start again at the fuse panel, and see what I can see and trace that bleepin fuse 13 wire a little ways. If I have to, I may take a couple of days or so off work and pull the dash out completely (out of the car) and check the harness. I REALLY don't want to do that, so, I'll think small and stick to the topic........

Checking wires...I'll re-re-check the fuse panel and nearby plugs, and then the cluster plug, column plugs,etc.

I'll put a new fuse in the panel tomorrow after I drop my son at school, turn on the head lights and see if that pops it.

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Post by: hwy73 on November 02, 2011, 07:13:48 PM

I have an 88 EVTM if you need any pages posted. I don't mean to butt in, but according to the fuse chart, the only circuit listed for fuse 13 is for "instrument illumination", which I know covers many items.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 02, 2011, 07:27:51 PM

Please, by all means, "butt in". I'll take ANY ideas one can toss out there. I'd ask for pics of the pages you speak of, but I don't know what I'm looking for. Another member here may have an idea. My owners manual shows fuse 13 to illuminate the gauges, a/c controls, and the stereo.

But my clock,a/c panel,gauges, headlight illumination panel, and console ashtray light are all blinking with the signal light. But not my outer two passenger side tail light bulbs.....What do they ALL have in common?

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Post by: EricCoolCats on November 02, 2011, 07:34:56 PM

If you keep popping fuse #13 then what appears to be happening is that whatever is shorting out is simply inoperable, while the power from the turn signal switch seems to be feeding back through that circuit. The electricity has to go somewhere, so it's dissipating where it can (ashtray light, gauges, etc).

My personal observation based on past experience...

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 02, 2011, 07:45:48 PM

Could there be something on the cluster that causes that? I pulled the ashtray bulb, and no change. I pulled the cluster, and no change. Swapped the signal assembly, all of the interior lights are working. The a/c controls are working,stereo is good, door locks, third brake light, every exterior light but the two bleeping outer passenger lights. Weird.crazy stuff. I pulled the stereo today and checked the wires. Couldn't find anything bad. I'm unsure what I missed...but apparently I missed something, or it would be fixed.

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Post by: flylear45 on November 02, 2011, 07:46:24 PM

Agreed Eric. Go after what you know is wrong and see if that leads you anywhere.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 02, 2011, 07:56:46 PM

I thought I did. I replaced bulbs, gave the cluster a really good look front and back, swapped switches,....I need a map. Is there some kind of tail lamp relay somehwere?

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Post by: hwy73 on November 02, 2011, 08:09:49 PM

I'll scan and post a few pages . Maybe someone will see something. Give me a few minutes..........

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Post by: EricCoolCats on November 02, 2011, 08:16:37 PM

Man...you've GOT to have a pinched LB/R wire somewhere. That would explain just about everything...

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 02, 2011, 08:30:18 PM

Eric, what's an "LB/R" wire?

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Post by: EFFalcon on November 02, 2011, 08:34:10 PM

light blue with red strip wire

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 02, 2011, 08:36:36 PM

Alrighty then. Hey, what color are the wires to the brake light switch at the pedal?

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Post by: Shadow on November 02, 2011, 08:45:55 PM

electrical noob lol

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Post by: hwy73 on November 02, 2011, 08:51:56 PM

Quote from: vinnietbird;371788

Alrighty then. Hey, what color are the wires to the brake light switch at the pedal?

LG/R (Light Green with Red Stripe), LG (Light Green)

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Post by: hwy73 on November 02, 2011, 08:53:54 PM

Here we go...........

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Post by: hwy73 on November 02, 2011, 08:59:43 PM

Here we go...........

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Post by: hwy73 on November 02, 2011, 09:07:02 PM

Here we go...............

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Post by: hwy73 on November 02, 2011, 09:08:25 PM

Couple more.........

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Post by: hwy73 on November 02, 2011, 09:17:43 PM

Fuse 13 receives power from the Main Headlight Switch, terminal "i" (illumination) which is the output of the dimmer control.
Fuse 13 feeds circuit 19 LB/R (Light Blue / Red) which powers the Illumination Lamps of the following:

Console Ashtray
Instrument Cluster
Radio
Clock (buttstuffog)
Cigar Lighter
AC/Htr Controls
Graphic Equalizer
Main Light Switch illumination

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Post by: hwy73 on November 02, 2011, 09:28:29 PM

One more...

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Post by: EricCoolCats on November 02, 2011, 10:23:06 PM

Yep, that is the one...lights-on power from the switch to the dash.
This situation has all the hallmarks attribUted to that wire, IMHO.

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Post by: Chrome on November 02, 2011, 10:30:20 PM

hwy73, Thank u so much for the diagrams! Now I can see what everybody is talking about. This fuse 13 is a great find. He may have a long road ahead, but at least he knows which way is north. What do you see for tail lamp illumination? I would like to see the connection between this fuse and the left tail lamp.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 02, 2011, 11:38:39 PM

Chrome, it's the right side (passenger side) tail lights that don't work...actually, the outer two lights. The inner is great.

I have to drop the fuse panel and look at the wire again. I'm sure it goes a few inches than into a taped bundle. Where it goes from there I'm unsure.

Could the light switch cause all that?

From my understanding, which is saying very little, I need to trace the LB/R wires from cluster,console, light switch, a/c illumination ,lighter,and clock and see where they go, and if they're damaged at all.

I don't have a volt/ohm checker.

This is like advanced Trigonometry.....which I didn't do, and glad of it.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 02, 2011, 11:39:29 PM

Quote from: EricCoolCats;371806

Yep, that is the one...lights-on power from the switch to the dash.
This situation has all the hallmarks attribUted to that wire, IMHO.

Eric, you're speaking of the LB/R wires?

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Post by: Chrome on November 03, 2011, 12:17:09 AM

Sorry Vinnie, It's been a long cold windy day. I work outdoors.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 03, 2011, 12:20:28 AM

Sorry for what? Jump on in to this chaos.

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Post by: Chrome on November 03, 2011, 12:25:20 AM

Yes, tracing the LB/R wire will eventually take you to the problem, however that is a lot of tracing with or without a DVOM. Headlamp switch is a link between interior illumination and tail lamps. It could be the cause, however I feel you have a pinched wire somewhere. Please don't replace the switch until we look a little further into this.

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Post by: Chrome on November 03, 2011, 12:30:31 AM

Left, Right..... as long as u know where u are going! lol If you have a spare headlight switch, it would be worth a try.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 03, 2011, 07:24:01 AM

I swapped the headlight switch. No change. Maybe it was bad as well.

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Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 03, 2011, 07:44:11 AM

You might also try looking at the white/light blue wire and the orange/light blue wire coming from your turn signal switch. The white/light blue wire is the one that feeds the right front turn signal and the green turn signal indicator in the cluster. The orange/light blue wire is the one that feeds the right rear turn signal. Since it is the right side that is messinng things up the problem has got to be a short between one of these two wires and the blue/red stripe one everyone else is talking about. Note: that orange/light blue wire also feeds the brake lights on the right side, so unless your dash lights come on when you hit the brake it's more likely in the white/light blue wire. You might find it easier to trace that one white/blue wire than tracing all of those blue/red ones that go everywhere. While tracing wires pay particular attention to any areas where the harness may have been pinched, or even punctured by a too-long screw (I've had these dashes out and know how easy it can be to use the wrong screw in the wrong hole)

One other consideration: Check any related connectors you've had unplugged (turn signal switch, headlight switch, insrtrument cluster, etc) for bent or misaligned pins. When I put my 88 back together one of the pins in the wiper switch got bent over. The connector still went together fine but the bent over pin was touching another pin and was causing lots of wierd wiper issues. It's not too much of a stretch to say a bent pin in a lighting related switch could cause wierd lighting issues as well.

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Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 03, 2011, 07:52:26 AM

Here is another suggestion that will greatly help in narrowing it down:

Turn on your turn signals so that the dash lights are acting up. Now move the dimmer wheel in the headlight switch up and down. If the dash lights stay bright (do not change) then the problem is somewhere on the "LOAD" side of the circuit (AFTER the dimmer switch). If they change in brightness the short is on the "FEED" side of the circuit (Before the dimmer switch).

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 03, 2011, 08:14:24 AM

I JUST dropped the Sport of to have the a/c charged (only time he had to get it done)....which sucks because I am on my last day off til Monday and had hoped to find this problem. Anyway...... When I get her home, I'll check those things. I haven't checked the dimmer switch like that.

As far as the plugs go, the only things I unplugged were the small plug that goes to the floor light under the glove box, and a two wire plug over there (the plug was flat and rectangular). That's it. I just pulled the dash back far enough on the passenger side to access the heater box. ....

....BUT, When I lowered the column, I had it resting on the seat, but the seat got moved back and it was hanging. Maybe it pulled something loose. I don't know. I'll check the wires you just mentioned when I get the Sport back and will report in as soon as I do.

Thanks a lot !!!!

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Post by: TOM Renzo on November 03, 2011, 03:41:59 PM

Vinnie

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Post by: TOM Renzo on November 03, 2011, 03:49:07 PM

[qu

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 03, 2011, 03:56:31 PM

Hey Tom. The fuse did blink. It was also blown. I replaced it, and it to blew. Not sure what caused it to. When the car gets home I'm going to swap the fuse again and check one switch at a time and see what's blowing it.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 03, 2011, 04:05:33 PM

Tom, I have to go get my wife from work. I'll be back soon with any info I can pass along to you. I hope to have the Sport back by then as well. Stay tuned.

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Post by: TOM Renzo on November 03, 2011, 04:07:18 PM

Thu

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 03, 2011, 05:43:52 PM

O.K., sorry for the delay. I will replace the fuse and see if the dimmer works. I did find something....two of the little copper contacts on my Sentry panel where the plug goes in are missing. Can that cause this?

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 03, 2011, 07:09:40 PM

Alright, I'm home !!!

I did the following...

1. Installed a new #13 5 amp fuse.

2. Turned on the headlights and the dash lights came on.

3. Pulled fuse and checked it.....still good.

4. Turned on the headlights and rotated the dimmer.

5. Pulled fuse.fuse still good.

6. Started car and turned on the right signal.

7. Pulled fuse.....fuse good

8. Turned on head lights, turned on signal.....signal doesn't flash.

9. Pulled fuse....fuse still good.

10. Turned on emergency flashers.

11. Pulled fuse....fuse still good.

12. Pushed the brake pedal

13. Pulled fuse,.....fuse still good

14. shook head in disbelief.

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Post by: CatManDude on November 03, 2011, 08:06:25 PM

Hey Vinnie,
So it sounds like you still have a problem...how about pulling out all of the fuses that have to do with tail lights and signals, looks like #1, 4, 5 and 15 all have to do with the rear lights in one way or another, and #11 and 13 because of the cluster lighting problem (I am suggesting #11 because the radio has a dimmer lead or leads that also is tied into the dash/marker lights). Turn on your turn signal with all of the fuses out and try installing each one by itself and see what happens. I'd try the #5 turn signal fuse first with all of the others out and see if you get any flash. If not, try each one by itself with the signal still turned on and see if you get the dim flashing to come back. If it does, it would seem logical that the circuit on that fuse is the one with the short or ground problem. If you go through all of the fuses with no change, maybe try leaving in #5 and do the same thing with the others. If all of that fails, I seem to vaguely remember having a similar problem on my first cougar back in about 1992, so it's a little foggy, but I seem to be remembering that it was either a bad 4-way module or a problem with my radio dimmer wire (I had installed a new stereo about that time). Is your stereo factory or aftermarket? Possibly could do it. Otherwise, I'm pretty sure all of the lighting goes through those big blue plugs on your steering column up near the wheel. I'd just make sure that maybe a cover screw didn't graze the insulation on one of them or maybe has rubbed a bare spot. And of course, the already mentioned loose pins in the plugs. Wish I could give a better answer, but hope this may help.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 03, 2011, 08:27:24 PM

I have an aftermarket CD player. I installed it about 4 years ago. Never had an issue, but after this core swap, mayeb something happened. The stereo still works great.

I'll check the fuses after work tomorrow. I'll also try to check the wires....again.

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Post by: TOM Renzo on November 03, 2011, 10:51:53 PM

Vinnie the only thing common to the dims and the signals is the lamps.(two filaments). They are crossing. Once again pull the flasher. and see if the flashing stops on the dash. Remember the dash is part of the DIMS. They are tied together. I am going to hit all data now and do some looking at the left signal and dim circuits Hang tight.

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Post by: TOM Renzo on November 03, 2011, 10:54:41 PM

Vinn

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 04, 2011, 06:55:11 AM

Tom, I'll check that after work. When I said dimmer, i meant the roller switch next to the headlight switch, not the dim switch on the signal switch. I will check those fuses after work today.

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Post by: TOM Renzo on November 04, 2011, 04:07:51 PM

Sorry vin

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Post by: Soul on November 04, 2011, 04:09:21 PM

Do not disturb for cold nights?

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 04, 2011, 05:48:59 PM

I JUST got home. Going out now to check the fuses and such before the dark sets in.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 04, 2011, 06:05:20 PM

Alright, I pulled fuse 15, no change.

I pulled fuse 5...no signals at all.

I pulled fuse 1, no change.

I pulled the signal relay..no signals.

I didn't pull the emergency flasher yet. It's on top of the fuse panel so I'll have to do that after work tomorrow at 3 o'clock. It clicks as it should when the emergency flashers are on, and they work fine.....except for the outer two passenger rear lights.

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Post by: TOM Renzo on November 04, 2011, 08:10:30 PM

Ok d

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 05, 2011, 06:57:43 AM

Removing the fuses didn't change anything. When I removed the signal light relay, I had no signals at all, so, I couldn't tell if that would help.

I'll double check that today when I get home, Tom. I'll also try to check the rest of the list you just passed along. Stay tuned. leaving for work now.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 05, 2011, 04:19:35 PM

Tom, are you talking about the emergency flasher, or signal relay?

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Post by: TOM Renzo on November 05, 2011, 07:25:55 PM

Signal

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 05, 2011, 07:35:01 PM

The flasher seems to be good for the emergency flasher lights. I was going to remove the sequentials, but decided to wait. I had to replace the inner sockets and bulbs so the sequentials can work as they should when I installed the kit. Now, I'm unsure how the lights will work without the factory sockets. i have a replacement tail light harness coming to me, we'll see what happens when it gets here. I'm betting it's behind the dash somewhere, but still no idea where. 2 weeks into this issue and no farther along than when I started. I am wondering if I'm going to have to replace the whole friggin harness. I think the Sport will find it's way to the crusher first (after I strip it of course).

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Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 05, 2011, 07:48:42 PM

If you remove the sequencer, simply connect the turn signal wire for the center and outer bulbs together and connect them to the car's turn signal wire. The innermost (closest to the license plate) only gets connected to the park light circuit to return to stock. The sequencer is not causing your dash lights to flash. If it has failed (or even if it only needs adjustment) it might be causing the center and outer lights not to come on, but it is not causing the dash light issue.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 05, 2011, 07:53:50 PM

I'm just trying to trouble shoot this ordeal. I'm unsure what to do with the electrical system. I've called everyone around here, and no shop will do that kind of electrical work. Only bulbs and sockets. Didn't the original inner lights have two wires? The ones I added have three. i can't remember. My mind is thinking about a mile of wires and a hundred different connections, and no sign of the issue anywhere I look (from what I cna see,anyway)./

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 05, 2011, 07:55:31 PM

i actually still believe it's somewhere under the dash, but holy . It looks like on my weekend off (in a week), I'll be pulling the dash completely out of the car and see what I can see. Maybe that will help.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 05, 2011, 08:06:46 PM

I'll be checking the harnesses under the carpet as well.

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Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 05, 2011, 08:10:58 PM

Yes, the original inner sockets had two wires. You will only be connecting to ground and park to return to stock...

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 05, 2011, 08:15:15 PM

I may wait to pull the seats and check the harnesses under the carpet first. My gut says under the dash somewhere, maybe under the carpet. I'll know as soon as I can get some #&%@$# time off. I hate my work schedule.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 05, 2011, 08:20:10 PM

How hard is it to swap the harness out under the dash? Not the harness for the computer.

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Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 05, 2011, 08:46:55 PM

Never done it, but remembering what mine looked like when I swapped the actual dash (and left the harness there) I'ma say it'd be a big bucket of suck...

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 05, 2011, 08:52:57 PM

Did it look like this..........

(http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc205/Vinnietbird/DSCF8633.jpg)

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 05, 2011, 08:54:28 PM

I'm starting to think I may need to swap the whole thing. No decisions being made on that until I look at a few more things, check under the carpet at the harness that runs down the side on the floor, and look behind the dash again. After that, then it will be an option.

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Post by: Shadow on November 05, 2011, 08:54:44 PM

Quote from: vinnietbird;372079

(http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc205/Vinnietbird/DSCF8633.jpg)

SPAGHETTI!! nom nom nom nom nom lol

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 05, 2011, 08:59:38 PM

Sickening picture, and what I MAY be looking at next Friday or Saturday......

....again.

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Post by: Chrome on November 05, 2011, 09:14:50 PM

I have to disagree with Thunder. A fault with the sequential unit could cause a backfeed that could cause dash lights to flash just like a shorted or ungrounded socket/bulb. If there is a problem with bypassing it I don't think I would worry. I still feel problem is around dash area. Still sounds like a ground issue, but it looks like we have covered all grounds. It really hurts the diagnostic process that u can't find what is blowing the fuse. Just figures when u actually want something to break it won't!

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 05, 2011, 09:25:03 PM

I JUST checked the fuse...not popped.

I turned on the signal light and the dash is not blinking with the signal now. Still don't have the two outer tail lights though. I got under the dash and pulled the cluster today after work.

On the back of the cluster, it LOOKED like the circuit sheet behind the cluster had a small tiny part that was folded over. I folded it back and secured it with quality tape (small piece). Maybe that caused the dash lights to flash, or maybe I moved, wiggled, whatever a wire under there when I was looking around. A small amount of progress. I had to wait til it got dark so I could check that.

Now, Thunder Chicken...how do i check the sequencer to see if it's causing the outer two lights not to work. Man, I love the sequentials. I'd hate to lose them.

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Post by: Shadow on November 05, 2011, 09:28:58 PM

use the test light to test the turn signal wire(s) that go INTO the sequencer.. in other words, the side with the harness that comes from the front of the car.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 05, 2011, 09:32:16 PM

I'll check them tomorrow after work first thing. Waiting for Thunder Chicken to let me know which wires to check. I should've kept the instructions.

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Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 06, 2011, 06:32:01 AM

Quote from: Chrome;372086

I have to disagree with Thunder. A fault with the sequential unit could cause a backfeed that could cause dash lights to flash just like a shorted or ungrounded socket/bulb. If there is a problem with bypassing it I don't think I would worry. I still feel problem is around dash area. Still sounds like a ground issue, but it looks like we have covered all grounds. It really hurts the diagnostic process that u can't find what is blowing the fuse. Just figures when u actually want something to break it won't!

Impossible. If the sequencer were causing a backfeed the park lights would have to flash too, it could not cause the dash lights to flash without causing the park lights to flash. Since the park lights are not isolated in T-Birds, causing one to light up would cause them all to light up, front and rear (in other words, introducing power anywhere in the circuit would energize the entire circuit). This short would have to work both ways, too - the park light circuit would then have to energize the right rear stop/turn circuit, so it would look like the right side brake lights were on any time the park lights were turned on. And even then the problem would have to be outside of the sequencer, such as in a socket, a pinched wire, or a faulty bulb. The sequencer is only connected to the stop/turn circuit and cannot feed any other circuits internally.

Matter of fact, it's very likely the "both ways" thing is what's causing the dash light fuse to blow. The short is definitely somewhere between the FRONT right turn signal circuit and the dash light circuit (it has to be front right - if it were the rear right the indicator in the dash would not come on with the park lights). Since the dash light fuse is a low amperage one the extra load caused by trying to energize the turn cignal circuit is blowing the fuse.

Vinnie: I'd have to know the vintage of your sequencer before I could offer troubleshooting help for it, as there were a few different generations. Could you take a pic of it?

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Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 06, 2011, 06:36:05 AM

Quote from: vinnietbird;372079

Did it look like this..........

(http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc205/Vinnietbird/DSCF8633.jpg)

Sort of. It looked more like this though:

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 06, 2011, 06:57:25 AM

I'll grab a pic of it for you Thunder Chicken.

The green signal indicator lights both come on and work fine. The fuse isn't popping now. Everything seems to be working fine except the outer two signal lights on the passenger side rear. First thing I'm going to check is under the carpet today, from there..............I have no idea.

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Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 06, 2011, 08:00:38 AM

Ok, if the two signal lights aren't working that might be sequencer related, probably just an adjustment. As for the dash light problem you were having, I don't know whether to be glad for you or sad: Glad that it's not acting up for you anymore, but sad because you didn't actually find and fix the problem, which means that means you've now got an intermittant electrical problem, and those are the very worst kind...

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Post by: Chrome on November 06, 2011, 10:34:41 AM

TC, I wish we would have disagreed sooner. It would have changed the way most of us have been looking at the problem. You are mostly if not 100% correct. I got to thinking about how the sequencer has to work. It is only on one side of the circuit. It is not the load, it is modifying the voltage going to the load. Simply put, it is delaying the voltage going to the multiple loads (bulbs). The ground is handled at the loads. Assuming the sequencer is a sealed unit, the sequencer can not be blamed for a short or bad ground. It can only be blamed for an open on the + side, which is not the issue here.

Correct me If I'm wrong, but I think Vinnie has already found the main problem. The short was at the printed circuit sheet behind the cluster. Could this have caused damage to the sequencer? If that's the case, replacement of the circuit sheet and the sequencer would solve all the problems.

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Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 06, 2011, 11:39:13 AM

I hadn't noticed that he'd found the printed circuit problem. If the problem is indeed in that printed circuit (and hopefully it is) it would result in a short between the turn signal indicator circuit (which is on the front turn signal circuit) and the dash lights. This kind of short would cause exactly the problems Vinnie's been having with his dash lights.

Since the front turn signal circuit is the fault, it would not cause sequencer failure. It appears Vinnie has two problems. Chances are that the sequencer issue had been happening before, but only noticed it when he noticed a problem with his dash lights and went out back to check what was working. It's fairly likely that the sequencer simply needs adjustment, but I need to see a photo of the sequencer to explain how to do it...

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Post by: Shadow on November 06, 2011, 11:39:17 AM

Quote from: Chrome;372133

Correct me If I'm wrong, but I think Vinnie has already found the main problem. The short was at the printed circuit sheet behind the cluster. Could this have caused damage to the sequencer? If that's the case, replacement of the circuit sheet and the sequencer would solve all the problems.

it's possible.. when the problem started, the circuits crossing from the cluster sheet may have damaged the sequential box.. that's actually VERY possible if his inner-most light on the passenger side is still working.. if that's working, than he's still getting a signal TO the sequencer.. vinnie, i think that is your problem with the turn signals, since you found what was making the dash lights blink

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Post by: softtouch on November 06, 2011, 12:43:13 PM

Quote from: vinnietbird;371742

I had pulled the cluster and tried the signal, still the same results.

The radio (cd player) still works as it should as well.

I had suspected the cluster to be where the two circuits came together.
This info steered me away from that theory.

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Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 06, 2011, 12:47:23 PM

It's actually not possible because the problem is in the front turn signal circuit, not the rear. Even if the dash lighting circuit were shorting into the rear turn signals, the sequencer would not be damaged because it only cares whether it sees power or not, it doesn't care where that power comes from. That's why it sequences once when the brake is pressed - it sees 12 volts, it sequences once. The only reason this process repeats with the turn signal is because the turn signal flasher in the dash keeps cutting power and this resets the sequencer.

The only remote possibility that this problem damaged the sequencer would be if the short was into the center or outer bulb circuit, as this would cause power to backfeed into the sequencer's SCR's and could possibly pop them. For this to happen, however, a wire would have to be run from the rear of the car (in particular, either the center or outer bulb) up to the front and shorted into the dash lights. I know Vinnie moved some wires around, but I doubt he did this. And if he's got an older sequencer with relays instead of SCR's even then it couldn't damage the sequencer, since the relays would be open and would simply not allow any power into the sequencer.

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Post by: Shadow on November 06, 2011, 01:26:00 PM

ok, so maybe it didn't short the sequencer.. but it's still possible that it's shot. his front signals and inner most tail light signal work as they should.. if his inner-most signal is working, than it shows that the sequencer is getting signal, but it's not sending power to the other 2 sockets.. it's not 'sequencing'

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Post by: Chrome on November 06, 2011, 02:15:17 PM

That would make sense. If front blinker is working fine and 1 bulb in the rear is working, the indicator would blink at normal speed. He would not have known there was a problem unless he got out of the car and looked. Most people don't leave the front seat of their car to check the turn signals while they are driving. LOL

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 06, 2011, 04:58:04 PM

I was moving a bunch of wires yesterday. Maybe that did it. I'm going to re-check everything when it gets dark again. As far as adjusting the tail lights, how? Do you mean with the tiny little screws? I'll give it a shot.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 06, 2011, 05:05:40 PM

When I push the brake pedal, only the inner most brake lights and third brake light come on.

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Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 06, 2011, 05:35:32 PM

This is why I need a photo of it, to determine the correct adjustment procedure. If it's an older one the engine must be running during any testing or diagnosis of the sequencer, as the voltage may be too low to turn on the relays.

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Post by: Shadow on November 06, 2011, 05:36:08 PM

both sides? or just the passenger side?

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Post by: TOM Renzo on November 06, 2011, 05:50:01 PM

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Post by: Shadow on November 06, 2011, 06:04:48 PM

Quote from: TOM Renzo;372162

Thunder is the sequencer a home made unit. Ford units are obsolete as i am told. Not 100%. So where do you get them Thanks.

they sell them as aftermarket kits.. on ebay, i see a lot of them for SN95 and newer stangs

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Post by: Chrome on November 06, 2011, 06:32:10 PM

The printed circuit does have a coating. Was it coated well? Could it have deteriorated after all these years? We have to remember this car is almost a quarter century old. I would double check the wires going to the cluster, but the printed circuit is most likely the fault. For now that problem seems to be solved. If it happens again we will know it is not the printed circuit. As for the sequencer, last night I was going through the archives and discovered Thunder Chicken would know the most about this unit. He can figure that out if anyone can.

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Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 06, 2011, 06:37:26 PM

I actually used to make the sequencers (Thundercat Electronixx). There were a few different generations. The first generation used relays to carry the load and were sensitive to system voltage, which is why the engine had to be running to test and/or diagnose them. Later generations used all solid state electronics (electronixx?) and were more stable at low voltages (though I still recommend having the engine running during testing and adjustments simply because you're more likely to be using your turn signal while the car's running and it's best to have the sequencers adjusted to the most common operating conditions). I pulled the plug on the whole thing when I did the math and discovered that between the US dollar shiznitting the bed and eBay/PayPal/Post office fees going heavenward I was actually losing money on 'em. Plus I really, sincerely, with-every-ounce-of-blood-coursing-through-my-veins hated dealing with eBay people. Especially eBay Mustang people...

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Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 06, 2011, 06:45:40 PM

Ok, just dug up some more information that seems to point to the cluster being the issue (with the dash lights). It seems that the Cluster Illumination terminal and the Right Turn Indicator terminals in the cluster are right next to each other in the connector at the cluster (terminals 13 and 14, respectively, for the buttstuffogue/Sport cluster Vinnie has). This means that if the printed circuit board is slightly misaligned or if the connector is inserted slightly crooked a short could easily happen between these two terminals.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 06, 2011, 08:04:41 PM

UPDATE to the UPDATE>>>> .Before I read the last few posts since 3:30 today, I pulled the seats and console after work. I looked under the carpet on the driver side, and there was a green wire with a yellow stripe (in a bundle of wires). It was melted. i followed the wire from the driver side kick panel, under the driver seat, over the tranny tunnel, under the passenger seat and up past the passenger side kick panel. I have no idea what the wire is for, or where it ends up or comes from, but I replaced the damaged area, and the rear lights are fine again on the driver side. The green signal lights on the dash are fine, the brake lights are fine, and the lights (all 6) come on when I turn on the headlights. The dash is not blinking anymore. I now, just don't have my outer two passenger tail lights in braking, emergency flashers, or signal lights. Only with the headlights on.. The driver side lights sequence as they should.

Thunder Chicken, here's the pic of the sequencer........

(http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc205/Vinnietbird/DSCF7068.jpg)

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 06, 2011, 08:07:55 PM

Where is terminal 13 and 14 on the cluster in the back? I didn't see any more damage. I can pull the cluster tomorrow to re-re-check.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: daminc on November 06, 2011, 08:24:26 PM

the green wire is the ground to the trunk, and fuel pump I believe... I think I had to splice that one for the mass air

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 06, 2011, 08:31:36 PM

I think this MAY be a different wire. I have nothing to base that opinion on other than the fuel pump and trunk stuff (trunk popper and light) all work great.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: daminc on November 06, 2011, 08:37:30 PM

you could be right... I may have just remembered seeing it last week checking my grounds

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 06, 2011, 08:49:28 PM

This is a skinny little, pea green wire with a yellow stripe. About 18 inches were damaged. Now repaired. That is, unless there's more under the dash that needs fixing. I have no idea where it goes.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: daminc on November 06, 2011, 09:26:21 PM

pea green? that doesn't sound familiar... drk green is what I remember.... My book is in the shop, I will look tomorrow if someone else hasn't found what it is by then

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 06, 2011, 10:19:54 PM

Thanks. I'm off work and should be around here. I think there was a dark green wire as well in that bundle.

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Post by: Chrome on November 06, 2011, 11:25:58 PM

Keep tracing... we're gaining!

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: TOM Renzo on November 07, 2011, 06:03:45 AM

[quo

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 07, 2011, 08:04:18 AM

Thanks Tom. I'll be around here most of the day today. The wire is in a bundle that starts from the driver side kick panel and goes along the floor, then under the driver seat, over the tranny hump, under the passenger seat, and back up the passenger side kick panel, and I'm guessing, under the dash.

On the other hand, it could start on the passenger side and go the other direction depending on how you look at it. I started on the driver side, so, that's where it started for me.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: flylear45 on November 07, 2011, 05:53:28 PM

Sounds like you've got some progress, Vinnie. You definitely have it on the run, now.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 07, 2011, 05:57:17 PM

I pulled the stereo, a/c controls, and sentry panel. No sign of a bad wire anywhere I can see. Maybe it's in the cluster. I'm getting a replacement soon. Car funds are gone, acquiring more as we speak. EVERYTHING works except the two outer passenger side signal lights.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: TOM Renzo on November 07, 2011, 07:04:17 PM

Vinn

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Post by: Chrome on November 07, 2011, 07:09:47 PM

Possibly the burned up wire could not be allowing enough voltage for the sequencer to sequence. Too bad U don't have a DVOM.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 07, 2011, 09:26:20 PM

I'll try to back probe the wire I repaired tomorrow. Maybe it is the sequencer. I don't know how to check the sequencer. Yes, it's wired right. It's been wired for a few years, and as of last month, all the lights were working. I was showing them to a Stang guy. It all happened after the core swap. SO, I still have to figure out the outer two lights.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 07, 2011, 09:26:48 PM

The burned up wire is repaired, but still no outer lights.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: TOM Renzo on November 07, 2011, 10:02:28 PM

Vinny

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Post by: daminc on November 07, 2011, 10:12:30 PM

Vinnie, what lights are out exactly.... parking lamps? front and back? or all ?

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Chrome on November 07, 2011, 10:19:19 PM

If that sequencer is made with solid state electronics it didn't stand a chance of surviving a short like that.

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Post by: Chrome on November 07, 2011, 10:25:36 PM

If TC was right, and front turn signal and rear turn signal are two different circuits, it makes me wonder what caused the short in the rear wiring.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 07, 2011, 10:51:11 PM

The exact light issue Jerry is the outer two rear passenger lights. That's it. Everything else is great. I have no idea unless it is the sequencer.

As far as what caused it, who knows/ Probably sliding the dash back in place and compromised a wire. All I can figure.

The rest of the lights, inside and out are working as they should. Only those two are inop.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: daminc on November 07, 2011, 11:02:17 PM

are those the running, and side marker lamps?

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 07, 2011, 11:09:23 PM

Just the two outer brake lights.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: daminc on November 07, 2011, 11:13:13 PM

no lights on at all..
even with brake on, or with lights on?

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 07, 2011, 11:25:30 PM

No brake lights. They come on with the headlights. Just no brake lights, or emergency flashers. When the brake pedal is pressed, only the inner light comes on.

When the signal light is turned on (passenger side), only the inner light comes on.

When the emergency flashers are on, only the inner light comes on.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Shadow on November 07, 2011, 11:32:56 PM

i'm willing to bet it's the sequencer.. i know, i sound like a broken record lol.. but if your inner most light is working, your sequencer IS getting the turn/stop signal from the front of the car.. at this point, it makes more sense than anything else. without a doubt, the sequencer is getting signal, but it's not sequencing.. it's a shame those things are hard-wired and not set up to plug in.. if that was the case, you could swap the driver side sequencer in and i bet all 3 bulbs would light up.. if i had a sequencer, i would send it to you to try out, but.. i don't

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 07, 2011, 11:39:44 PM

It's a one piece unit for all 6 lights. I think I may need one as well.. Thunder Chicken,Make me one !!!!!! And, how do I check the one I have?

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Shadow on November 08, 2011, 12:04:47 AM

beings it's a 1 piece unit.. :dunno: .. do you still have the wiring diagram/installation instructions for it?

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Post by: softtouch on November 08, 2011, 12:33:41 AM

From the 87 EVTM:
LG/Y (Light Green/Yellow) wire is the "hot at all times" wire from fuse 8.
Courtesy Lamps, Power Door Locks, Illuminated Entry, Power Outside Mirrors, Keyless Entry

It goes to:
Cluster connector C246 terminal 17. Powers electronic speedometer module.
Illuminated entry timer.
Left Hand door switch. Powers the warning chime and courtesy lights.
Right hand door switch. Powers courtesy lights.
Dome light switch in the headlight switch.
Glove box light.
Power mirror control switch.
Console storage box light.
Map lights.
Right and left vanity lights.
Keyless entry module.
Digital clock.
Power door lock relays.

I am sure I have missed something.
Don't know if you disconnect the battery when getting into stuff with wires.
You definitely should.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: TOM Renzo on November 08, 2011, 05:39:15 AM

Vinnie

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Post by: flylear45 on November 08, 2011, 06:02:38 AM

Makes perfect sense to me as well. I think you've got it licked now guys.

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Post by: TOM Renzo on November 08, 2011, 06:04:18 AM

Vinnie f

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Post by: TOM Renzo on November 08, 2011, 06:13:11 AM

[quot

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 08, 2011, 06:42:18 AM

Thanks guys. I'll check them when I get home today from work.

Tom, when I push the brake lights, the driver side sequences out as it should, and the passenger side only has the inner light. When the signal light and brake are pushed, only the inner light on the passenger side comes on and blinks, the driver side is great, as are the front lights and dash lights.

I'll get the test light out and report what I find when I get home. Stay tuned around 4:00 or so.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 08, 2011, 06:42:50 AM

Quote from: Shadow;372296

beings it's a 1 piece unit.. :dunno: .. do you still have the wiring diagram/installation instructions for it?

No, the instructions are long gone.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on November 08, 2011, 08:56:50 AM

Don't know if this covers the one you have but it may help...

http://www.foxthundercats.net/electronixx/index.html (http://"http://www.foxthundercats.net/electronixx/index.html")

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Post by: Shadow on November 08, 2011, 11:41:28 AM

Quote from: TOM Renzo;372311

Shadow all he needs to do is check the stock wiring in the car that comes from the signal switch. That is the LG/O For the left and the O/LB for the right. This will confirm his stock wiring and the repair he did is OK.

i know, but as for testing the sequencer itself, i haven't a clue.. i didn't know the factory signal/brake light wire colors because i don't have a diagram in from of me.. i've been saying sequencer this whole time lol

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Post by: TOM Renzo on November 08, 2011, 12:59:28 PM

I he

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Post by: Shadow on November 08, 2011, 01:22:14 PM

that's what i was thinking, switch the signal wires from the front of the car at the sequencer, and flip on the left signal to test the right tail lights.. but s simple check with the test light should confirm it.. basically, what i believe happened is whatever sequences the passenger side shorted out, leaving him with just the inner-most bulb. the cluster sheet was just throwing everything else off and making it appear to be somewhere else.

and i believe you're right, they use a special flasher that doesn't flash quickly when a bulb is out, because the sequencer makes the OEM style flasher think there is a bulb blown.. at least that's what i remember from when i looked into doing sequential lights in my old sport

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Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 08, 2011, 05:20:08 PM

Vinnie: Sorry for not getting back earlier, between work and other stuff I haven't had much in the way of free time.

To adjust the sequencer, turn the little metal screw closest to the wires for the passenger side counter clockwise while the turn signal is on. You might have to turn the screw several full 360-degree turns before you see a difference. If you don't see any difference after 15 full turns, try clockwise a bunch of turns and then counter clockwise again. If this makes no difference, try disconnecting the ground for the sequencer, and then turn on the signal lights. Disconnecting the ground causes the timers inside the sequencer to all go high at the same time, which means all three lights should come on at once. If they do, this means that the timer or adjustment circuit inside the sequencer has shiznit the bed. If they don't, try having somebody hold the brake on while you probe the green, black and white wires coming from the sequencer. The green should definitely have power, as this feeds the innermost light and that one's working. If you have power at either of the other two this means the problem is in your bulbs or sockets. If you don't have any power the SCR's inside the sequencer have packed it in (an SCR is kind of like a solid state relay).

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Post by: TOM Renzo on November 08, 2011, 05:47:47 PM

[quote

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 08, 2011, 07:48:43 PM

Sorry guys, Raining today. No outside love for the Sport. I'll try agin tomorrow. hang in there. I'll be on it tomorrow.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 11, 2011, 05:35:23 PM

I just got home. Gonna change clothes and do the tests Thunder Chicken advised a few posts up. I'll pass along the data I find (or don't find) in a while.

I would hate for the sequencer to be bad, but on the other hand, if it is, at least I'll know the remaining issue and can do what I can to fix it.

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Post by: Shadow on November 11, 2011, 05:38:54 PM

i would think the best test to try first is disconnect the sequencer ground and see if they work as normal tail lights, like thunder chicken said they should (no sequencing, but typical tail lights with all 3 lights lit at once

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 11, 2011, 05:44:06 PM

That'll be the first thing I do. Getting ready to go in a minute. Waiting for a response from a fellow member about a kit he has. I need it to replace mine (probably).

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Post by: Shadow on November 11, 2011, 06:05:38 PM

good luck!

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 11, 2011, 06:58:17 PM

O.K., only the green wire flashes when I put the test light to it. When I disconnected the ground, no change. I still have the one light on the passenger side. So, bad sequencer?

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Shadow on November 11, 2011, 07:03:31 PM

according to thunder chicken, that should have lit all 3 lights.. which side of the sequencer did you test, the IN or OUT?

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Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 11, 2011, 07:12:02 PM

Ok, the sequencer's SCR's may have popped, though it'd be strange for both to pop (there are two per side). Perhaps the sequencer saw a voltage spike.

Cut the wires going into the sequencer for the passenger side, but leave a few inches in case you have to reconnect it. Now connect the red, green, black and white wires together (do NOT connect the sequencer's ground to this bundle, when I say black wire I mean the one in the yellow harness). This should give you all three lights on the passenger side. If it doesn't the problem is in the bulbs and/or sockets, or the ground to the passenger tail lights (the innermost bulb you added when installing the sequencer will have its own ground).

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 11, 2011, 07:46:12 PM

Tomorrow morning , I'll be all over it. I'll post results right after that. I really hope it's only the sequencer. Another member here has one like mine that I'm going to buy to replace mine. As I stated, that's my favorite part of the car.

Where is the ground to the passenger side tail lights? In the trunk?

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Post by: hwy73 on November 12, 2011, 12:03:10 AM

Ground 1201: Left-hand (driver's side) rear luggage compartment (trunk), above wheelhouse
Splice 1204: In rear lamp harness, near tape-out to right-hand rear side marker
Splice 1207: In rear lamp harness, near tape-out to left-hand inboard running lamp

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 12:22:46 AM

Thanks a lot. I'll check them as well.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 03:18:14 PM

I cut the red,white, green, and black wire, connected them together, and now I only have the inner light on both sides. The driver side is now inop as well. !!! At least I had the driver side until that little fiasco. Now, brakes, signals, only the inner lights on both sides.

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Post by: Shadow on November 12, 2011, 03:22:41 PM

that may just be in how you hooked it up.. not sure exactly what you did, as i'm not there to take a gander and don't know what wire is what without looking at the harness.. it may be because you clipped the ground for the outter bulbs.. don't know if your sequential kits required you to do so or if you just clipped it in route of disabling your sequencer

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 03:34:59 PM

I put the wires back to their original places, still only have the inner most lights. (Place your choice of prime rate cuss word here _______).

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 03:39:38 PM

I'm thinking the sequencer is toasted.....crispy toasted inside.

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Post by: Shadow on November 12, 2011, 03:40:40 PM

including the ground(s)? i bet if you clipped the ground wires to the outter sockets, added a stretch of wire and grounded them on the inner-socket's ground, they'll all work

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 03:44:16 PM

Thunder Chicken stated to take the red, green, black, and white wire to the passenger side and twist them together. That's what I did. I got the wires from the yellow harness of wires from the sequencer as directed. Not the center ground wire, or the driver side. maybe I missed something, but I don't think so.

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Post by: Shadow on November 12, 2011, 03:46:55 PM

:dunno:

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 03:48:31 PM

Quote from: Shadow;372708

:dunno:

Yeah, Me too.

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Post by: Shadow on November 12, 2011, 03:55:11 PM

my best guess is the ground, since the inners are working and they're on their own ground.. did you twist the wires all together or did you twist the wires on the IN side of the sequencer with the socket side of the harness, color to color, individually?

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 04:02:23 PM

Sequencer side.....Oh, wait a minute. Maybe that was wrong and I mis-read.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 04:05:22 PM

Now what? Man, I HATE this stuff. More than I can say. I gotta get fundage to get that other sequencer kit stat.

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Post by: Shadow on November 12, 2011, 04:05:48 PM

yeah lol.. twist them together, color to color individually, basically making it a stock harness again

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 04:07:14 PM

Quote from: vinnietbird;372712

Sequencer side.....Oh, wait a minute. Maybe that was wrong and I mis-read.

I guess looking back, twisting the light ends make s more sense. THIS is why I DON"T do electric. Some things I just get. Some things I don't. This is one of those things that eludes my simple little mind.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 04:08:12 PM

I'm going back out to look...................

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Post by: Shadow on November 12, 2011, 04:10:11 PM

it's ok electrical noob lol.. check your fuses just incase you popped 1 by tying them all together.. with the wires hooked up as 'factory,' everything should work correctly

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 04:13:13 PM

I THINK I can put it back to stock, but one problem. The sequencer kit came with new inner bulbs. They have three wires, and the factory bulbs had two. What do I do with the inner 3 wire lights that took the place of the two wire sockets?

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 04:17:37 PM

The fuses look good.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 04:25:56 PM

The 3 wire inner lights are holding me back right now from "repairing" the harness to stock.

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Post by: Shadow on November 12, 2011, 04:26:31 PM

for now, you can leave 1 of the positive socket wires disconnected for testing. it won't be hot because it's coming out of the socket and not the harness.. you can't really mess it up.. if you have to wire it temporarily to drive it until you get another sequencer, you can tie the turn signal/brake light wire in with the center bulb's signal/brake wire.. but for now, lets focus on getting your outters to work properly! lol

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 04:39:01 PM

See what I mean, I have no ideas what you meant. What positive socket wires? From the inner light? I'm running in and out from here to the %$@*&%@ car.

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Post by: TOM Renzo on November 12, 2011, 04:54:43 PM

Vin

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 04:57:50 PM

I think I have the wiring mostly done. Now for the inner lights. There are three wires...two black and one white. The wires from the harness (2 of them) are black, and brown.

Now, with the three wires from the inner light....Do I connect the white wire from the socket to the brown wire in the harness, and then one black wire to the harness black wire?

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 05:00:38 PM

Quote from: TOM Renzo;372728

Vinnie the 1157 lamp has a double filament. Dims and brake/signal. One filament is brighter than the other just use one of those wires. It is just for testing purposes. If the lamp is duller then use the other wire. Just leave one hanging in the BREEZE!! Normally the red wire is the signal/brake and the black is the dims or parking lights.

I don't have those color options. I have a brown wire and a black wire from the harness, and two black wires and a white wire from the socket.

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Post by: Shadow on November 12, 2011, 05:03:52 PM

the inner socket's positive wires.. 1 is the 'parking lamp,' the other is for turn signal/brake light.. you can bridge the signal/brake light wire to the center socket's signal/brake light wire and all 3 lights will still light up when you use your turn signal or when you hit the brakes

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Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 12, 2011, 05:06:39 PM

Just omit the green wire from your red/green/black/white combo. The green wire feeds the innermost light, so omitting it will make that light revert to park only.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 05:06:47 PM

SO, do you mean put the two black wires from the socket end to the black wire in the harness, then the white wire from the socket to the brown wire in the harness?

Awaiting confirmation..........

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 05:08:35 PM

Quote from: Thunder Chicken;372733

Just omit the green wire from your red/green/black/white combo. The green wire feeds the innermost light, so omitting it will make that light revert to park only.

I'm removing the sequencer from the car altogether. A fellow member has a kit like mine that I'm going to get and re-install once this is past me. I'm going back to stock right now. I have another trunk harness I'll graft in before the sequencer kit I'm getting goes in.

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Post by: Shadow on November 12, 2011, 05:09:33 PM

holy i just got lost LOL.. do either of the black wires on the socket have a stripe?

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 05:10:00 PM

Quote from: Shadow;372732

the inner socket's positive wires.. 1 is the 'parking lamp,' the other is for turn signal/brake light.. you can bridge the signal/brake light wire to the center socket's signal/brake light wire and all 3 lights will still light up when you use your turn signal or when you hit the brakes

I re-read that. Which wire from the center would be the right one to tap in to?

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 05:10:55 PM

Quote from: Shadow;372736

holy i just got lost LOL.. do either of the black wires on the socket have a stripe?

No.

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Post by: Shadow on November 12, 2011, 05:11:51 PM

that someone else would have to lead you on.. i'm not sure as i don't have a diagram in my face or a car (here) to test to figure it out..

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 05:12:02 PM

I'm telling you....You seem to understand electrical better than me (so does any first grader), imagine my point of view here.LOL.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 05:12:32 PM

Thunder Chicken may know, he designed the system.

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Post by: Shadow on November 12, 2011, 05:12:36 PM

Quote from: vinnietbird;372738

No.

well that's stupid.. must be a chinese socket.. lol

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Post by: Shadow on November 12, 2011, 05:13:40 PM

Quote from: vinnietbird;372740

I'm telling you....You seem to understand electrical better than me (so does any first grader), imagine my point of view here.LOL.

i understand most of it, but it gives me headaches.. consider yourself lucky that you haven't had to mess with it until this problem arose lol

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 05:13:57 PM

May be. I am unsure.

Thunder Chicken, I'm down to the inner sockets..which wires do I need to tend to?

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 05:22:51 PM

Quote from: Shadow;372743

i understand most of it, but it gives me headaches.. consider yourself lucky that you haven't had to mess with it until this problem arose lol

Oh, I did. Last year around this time, I was installing the sun visors, and a screw went through a wire above the headliner (I didn't know that at the time), and it melted a hole about the size of a golf ball through the fuse panel. I had to replace the panel, and two small harnesses to and above the headliner.

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Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 05:26:03 PM

Quote from: vinnietbird;372744

May be. I am unsure.

Thunder Chicken, I'm down to the inner sockets..which wires do I need to tend to?

..meaning, do I twist the black wires together and hook them to the black wire in the harness, then the white wire from the socket to the brown wire?

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Post by: Shadow on November 12, 2011, 05:29:35 PM

NOOOOOOO.. twisting the 2 black socket wires together will turn both filaments on at all times, when the parking lights are on.. you just need to determine which wire is your parking light and which is the turn signal/brake light wire.. i imagine the white is the wire you have grounded?

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 05:34:28 PM

O.K., I double checked....as it is Now, before I put it back to stock... The white wire from the socket goes to the black wire in the harness. One black wires from the socket goes to the brown wire in the harness, and one black wire goes to the sequential. SO, I think I just need to remove the green wire from the equation (unplug the black from it), and call it a day. NOW, I think That's what Tom and Chicken both meant.

Sound good?

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 05:35:31 PM

Oh Man !!! If this works, I'm going to ..........I don't know what I'm going to do, but I'll have a huge sigh of relief, and can move forward with this. Today marks the third week of this BS.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 05:36:41 PM

I have wire cutters

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 12, 2011, 05:37:32 PM

If memory serves the white wire on that universal inner socket is the ground. the two black ones coming from the bottom of the socket are the stop/turn and park wires. one of them should be connected to a brown wire in the car's harness (the car's factory "park" wire). The other one should be connected to the green wire that was connected to the sequencer. Simply disconnect that green wire.

As for the other two sockets, cut the sequencer's white and black wires from the sockets, and cut the sequencer's red wire from the car's harness. Now connect the car's harness wire to the socket wires you just cut the sequencer's wires from, and you should be back to stock wiring

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 05:39:15 PM

Chicken, I have the outer sockets on both sides installed back to their original location in the harness. Going to clip the green wires and do a test.

STAY TUNED!!!!!!!!!!!!

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 05:46:43 PM

YEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The lights are all working, back to stock. Finally.

THANKS to you all who have helped with the tech info, and holding my hand for 3 weeks.

NOW...Once I get the new sequential kit, I'm going back to that, and never pulling my dash again....ever....unless I have to.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Shadow on November 12, 2011, 05:53:27 PM

since you now have tail lights again, i can say..

Quote from: Shadow;370943

could be the sequential module.. but that'd be the least of my worries if the car just randomly died, lost all power and poof, started right back up lol i would check the wires from the module to see what kind of voltage you're getting, you could just have super py bulb sockets.. i've replaced those stupid things more times than i've done tune-ups

post #5.. i was right from the start.. GO ME! :D where's my prize LOL just kidding.. glad she's fixed!

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Chrome on November 12, 2011, 05:54:33 PM

Ya'll lost me with all the different colors of wires. Makes me think of Skittles............mmm... taste the rainbow.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Shadow on November 12, 2011, 05:56:32 PM

.. now i want skittles..

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Chrome on November 12, 2011, 06:00:18 PM

Somehow I missed the 9 messages before I posted that. Vinnie should get the skittles to celebrate with.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 06:03:59 PM

I would eat some, but my diet won't allow it. I'm getting back in shape.

As far as the cause, I think a wire behind the dash was affected, then, it caused a wire under the carpet to fry, which caused the sequencer to out. Man, what a long ride this has been. I will sleep well tonight. For 3 weeks, I have thought about this problem every single day. I'm sure many here can relate when there's an issue on the car you're trying to work out.

Once again, I will say, THIS is why I love this forum. people have your back and are willing to help the best they can, myself included (just don't ask me for electrical help). LOL.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Shadow on November 12, 2011, 06:04:37 PM

i bet he's doing a song and dance in the driveway, while his neighbors stare at him with a strange look on their face.. lol

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 06:08:51 PM

Sorry, I'm back. I was out singing and dancing in the driveway.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Chrome on November 12, 2011, 06:11:44 PM

I think that is exactly what happened. As for the diet...............salad. mmm.... taste the fertilizer. lol

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 06:15:12 PM

Lots of baked chicken, fresh fruits and some vegetables (I don't like very many veggies). It's working, I'm getting stronger, and down 20 pounds......

.....and the Sport's lights work !!!!

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Shadow on November 12, 2011, 06:17:45 PM

Quote from: vinnietbird;372764

Sorry, I'm back. I was out singing and dancing in the driveway.

called it.. lol

Quote from: vinnietbird;372762

myself included (just don't ask me for electrical help). LOL.

aww, come on.. you're a pro now! :giggle:

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 06:23:27 PM

If I'm a pro now, lord help the rookies out there. LOL.LOL.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Shadow on November 12, 2011, 06:26:02 PM

that cluster sheet really threw things for a loop.. lol

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 06:39:28 PM

Well,Now that everything seems to be fine,I can start body work finally. And, as I said, sequentials will be back on the port in a couple of weeks. It's part of her character.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 06:42:50 PM

I have literally been on this thread for over 3 1/2 hours.

Considering I got something accomplished, it's a good thing.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: flylear45 on November 12, 2011, 06:48:29 PM

" Good news everyone! "

Glad to hear it's a wrap, Vinnie. Good work on the troubleshooting. I know you were being helped, but there's no substitute for the guy on the multimeter. Now get that sucker in paint!

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 12, 2011, 06:50:01 PM

I have to say you guys did it. I just followed instructions after they were explained 3 times.LOL.Yes, body work time !!!!!

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: hwy73 on November 12, 2011, 07:44:04 PM

I'm glad it is fixed, but in a way I'm a little disappointed because I won't have the suspense of opening this thread twice a day! ;)

(Red is positive + , Black is negative - DON'T CUT THE GREEN WIRE!) ;);)

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 12, 2011, 07:47:44 PM

Just thank God that original short you had didn't give you a REAL baked chicken...

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 13, 2011, 12:49:16 AM

Quote from: Thunder Chicken;372782

Just thank God that original short you had didn't give you a REAL baked chicken...

That's what I was most scared of.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: Kitz Kat on November 13, 2011, 03:22:19 AM

Told you so. Glad you got it.

Title: Need help FAST !!!!! FIXED !!!!
Post by: vinnietbird on November 13, 2011, 09:40:18 AM

Thanks Kitz. And thanks for the "pep talk" again. Now to start swapping the hood and header panel and getting ready for paint.

Fox T-Bird/Cougar Forums

Technical => Electrical Tech => Topic started by: vinnietbird on October 24, 2011, 01:17:05 PM