Technical => Body/Appearance/Interior => Topic started by: vinnietbird on March 26, 2009, 05:34:10 PM
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on March 26, 2009, 05:34:10 PM
I was wanting to install my push to start button and had no idea where.I didn't want to move the clock,or take that spot.I didn't want to drill any holes in the dash panels,and I wanted it to look factory (as much as i can).This is what I came up with.It's the lower right dash panel next to the right side of the steering column.I pulled the panel from a TC and made the backing plate from a s dash piece.I had a friend make the "push to start" badge.As most of you know,I like the Sport to be different,yet subtle.Honest opinions,what do you guys think?
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on March 26, 2009, 05:37:09 PM
I'll install the wiring and relay as soon as I have the time to do so.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: jpc647 on March 26, 2009, 05:45:01 PM
I think it looks good vinnie. My dad used to have a 71 lincoln that he installed a push to start in it. Again, thumbs up.
What the wiring consist of? How do you make it work?
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on March 26, 2009, 05:47:27 PM
I haven't really got into it yet.There are 4 or 5 wires and a relay.I'll let you know where they go as soon as I know for sure.I have the instructions in my small parts box.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: daminc on March 26, 2009, 05:52:47 PM
There you go, stealing all my good ideas again. ;) JK Looks like it belongs there if you ask me. Good job Vin.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: t3skidoo on March 26, 2009, 06:17:36 PM
Looks good but I'd change the label to something else, like 'emergency rocket boost' or 'passenger eject'
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: baxo on March 26, 2009, 06:23:30 PM
I dont think you could have found a better place to put it, and the label looks great too
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: 86XR7project on March 26, 2009, 06:37:35 PM
Gah! Another thing I wanted to do stolen right out of under me!!! !
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: EricCoolCats on March 26, 2009, 07:13:55 PM
Looks great Vinnie!
My uncle used to use push buttons on all his old cars. One for the ignition, one for the wipers, one for the radio power, and so on...he didn't have the patience to actually fix the problems, but man, could he ever find the patience to wire in a push button LOL.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on March 26, 2009, 08:11:49 PM
Thanks guys.I had thought of different wording for the little "push to start" label,but,in the long run,I wanted a factory feel to it.Either way,if I change my mind some day,I can change it in about 30 seconds.Nothing to it.
Jerry (daminc),I have a little panel like that for you.I found it when I found mine.It was shipped with the keys and locks.
As far as stealing ideas,NOT !!! LOL (I know you guys were kidding........).I try to be original,and do a lot of things that will be unique to my Sport alone.I go out of my way not to copy.I appreciate the input,and welcome any more that may be given.Once I install it,I'll let you guys know how it turns out,and I'll grab some pics,also,when my son's camera gets back from being repaired,I'll make a short video of the button in action.
Some of the buton ideas I had were....
-Atomic batteries to power -Go-Go button -Grumble or Rumble button -Do you feel lucky -On your mark,Get set,PUSH -Love button -Click here -For a good time...Push Here
That's a few.Yes,I put thought into it.LOL. -
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: 86XR7project on March 26, 2009, 09:01:07 PM
How about: "Engage warp drive" "The fun starts here" "Push me, I dare you"
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: 32VFoxBird on March 26, 2009, 09:52:27 PM
"Ludicrous Speed!"
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: Haystack on March 26, 2009, 10:16:34 PM
I like it. Couldn't you just fuse it and use a wire on the solenoid? Thats how I start my car when I'm working on it. Thats way it won't try to start without the key on as well.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on March 26, 2009, 10:22:15 PM
Maybe.I don't know.I'll try to stick to the instructions.They look pretty detailed.I want it "right".
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: Haystack on March 26, 2009, 10:50:53 PM
Fair enough. I wouldn't blame you at all there.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on March 27, 2009, 12:07:26 AM
I still have to install the harness that came with the NOS Hella fog lights.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: thunderjet302 on March 27, 2009, 01:01:46 AM
Looks good :D
I have a button in that spot on my T-bird already. It's for the power antenna;)
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: mcb82gt on March 27, 2009, 08:14:14 AM
That location was going to be my suggestion. I think you did a great looking job.
Once the car is running, I assume it locks out the starter so some asshat doesnt reach over and push it, right??
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on March 27, 2009, 08:18:14 AM
Yes,Once it's started,the process is over,and you still need the keys,or no starty.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: massCougarxr7 on March 27, 2009, 08:34:44 AM
That looks so clean, i like it a lot. i also wanted to install buttons for everything in my car when my 460 gets swapped in. I think it would be cool to get in your car and turn on everything like your fuel pump, and evrything........Itll sound like a jet when you fire it up!!!!
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on March 27, 2009, 09:16:26 AM
To be truthful,I did think about installing buttons in a pen 15pit fashion like a jet,but decided to keep everything somewhat stock looking,or at least only mildly changed.Nothing too wild or extreme.I'm just a simple guy.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: 86XR7project on March 27, 2009, 09:34:26 AM
You will have to put detailed pics of the install. I'd love to see how this is achieved.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: mercury-man on March 27, 2009, 09:39:14 AM
Looks great, V-man you could also label it (Whatever You Do Don't press the RED button). :evilgrin:
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on March 27, 2009, 10:23:05 AM
Sorry Dan,the Sport is gonna have to remain a simple girl.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: ~AC on March 27, 2009, 10:34:44 AM
that looks good. came out with the same finish as OEM. the MX5 came with the push button start in place of the cig lighter. the cig lighter is to the right of the steering wheel so it actually looks like thats where it should go. its just a bitch that i have to turn the car on with the keys, then hit the button for ignition.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: shorangerbird on March 27, 2009, 10:43:47 AM
-"EASY" button...:hick:
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on March 27, 2009, 10:55:25 AM
I like the key idea.No accidents from inquiring minds with itchy fingers.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: 86XR7project on March 27, 2009, 11:02:07 AM
Quote from: ~AC;264257
that looks good. came out with the same finish as OEM. the MX5 came with the push button start in place of the cig lighter. the cig lighter is to the right of the steering wheel so it actually looks like thats where it should go. its just a bitch that i have to turn the car on with the keys, then hit the button for ignition.
This makes it a little harder to steal. Makes sense if you ask me.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: massCougarxr7 on March 27, 2009, 11:05:22 AM
i want all of mine hidden, under front edge of seat, or under the dash......
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on March 27, 2009, 11:09:16 AM
I want everything to be seen,but not necessarily noticed.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: 86XR7project on March 27, 2009, 11:12:36 AM
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on March 27, 2009, 11:25:00 AM
Right on.
I had seen that button before that you posted.It fits in aa factory location on the new Stangs.I needed a more universal application.I bought it having no idea where it was going.Plus,as always with me,cost is a factor.I try to keep it as cheap as possible.That's just how I roll.LOL.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: 86XR7project on March 27, 2009, 11:30:32 AM
Yeah I'm the same way. I kind of want to do the same "Looks stock" thing. I thought about finding an S2000 starter button too. I've heard those are about the same to wire up.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on March 27, 2009, 11:32:21 AM
There are some cool ones on Ebay as well.I had my friend who woks at Autozone order mine.I forgot what company,it was about a year ago or so.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: 86XR7project on March 27, 2009, 11:45:13 AM
Yeah I was just looking at them on eBay. Looks like you can do it reletively cheap. Might just have to order one.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on March 27, 2009, 01:52:23 PM
After this,I have a few more ideas coming soon.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: jpc647 on March 27, 2009, 02:12:57 PM
Quote from: vinnietbird;264093
I haven't really got into it yet.There are 4 or 5 wires and a relay.I'll let you know where they go as soon as I know for sure.I have the instructions in my small parts box.
Was there a kit or something? lol where'd you get the kit?
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on March 27, 2009, 02:27:23 PM
The button came as a kit in a tall skinny box.It had different colored lenses for the switch,red,clear,and blue.I took the red lens,painted it red from behind to make it more opaque,then re-assembled it all.Check around on Ebay,there are a LOT of kits there.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: jpc647 on March 27, 2009, 02:59:55 PM
Alright thanks. I just wanted to know if they were availible or if this was something you've engineered lol
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on March 27, 2009, 03:00:58 PM
Th kit is as delivered (except for the paint I added),and the panel was engineered.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: ~AC on March 27, 2009, 07:41:16 PM
The "engine start button" i think that was installed in my car came from http://www.miatamania.com part # 101-470 and comes at a price of $29.95. of course the word "start" has started rubbing off.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: jcassity on April 02, 2009, 07:48:17 PM
this should work
in reality , you could jumper 30 to 86 on the relay. 30 wont get any power till you push the button anyway.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: Thunder Chicken on April 02, 2009, 08:48:52 PM
Scott, what's the point of the relay in your diagram? The starter relay is already a low-current circuit, so the relay is redundant (you're using a relay to turn a relay on).
Also, the way that is wired the starter would spin any time the button is pressed. It'd be better to feed it off the red/light green "RUN" wire off the ignition switch, as this would allow it only to spin the starter when the key is in "RUN".
Vinnie, in response to your PM, you should connect the switch as follows:
Remove the lower steering column shroud to access the ignition switch wiring. This is the best place to pick up your power feeds, since you're going straight to the source.
RED (constant feed): Connect this to one of the thick yellow wires at the ignition switch YELLOW (switched 12V feed): Connect this to the red/light green stripe wire at the ignition switch WHITE: (start): Connect this to the red/light blue wire at the ignition switch. If you want to retain the START function in the ignition switch simply "T" into this wire. If you want to lose the start function of the ignition switch and make it so that you must use the button, cut the red/light blue wire and connect the starter button's white wire to the harness side of the cut. Tape the ignition side of the cut up so it can't short to anything. Personally, I'd keep the start function in the ignition switch, because constantly forgetting about that button would get old really quick...
NOTE: You should install inline fuse holders in both the red (constant) and yellow (switched) and fuse both at no more than 10 amps. If you tap into those ignition switch wires with no fuses it's as good as connecting directly to the battery, and could cause a fire if that starter button ever shorts out or if the wires you run ever chaffe on anything.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: jcassity on April 02, 2009, 10:59:04 PM
see edits below, I suggested he could put the push button by putting one side on the ign sw yellow and the other side to the red/light blue. He explained he wanted a redundant feature, cause his friend had a fire. Until he is able to tell us the ampacity rating of the push button, I wouldnt use the push button to power the fender starter relay. He said it was very light feeling and the contacts on it are oddly tiny.
He asked how to wire his kit,,
Quote from: Thunder Chicken;265568
Scott, what's the point of the relay in your diagram? The starter relay is already a low-current circuit, so the relay is redundant (you're using a relay to turn a relay on).
[COLOR="Blue"][COLOR="Blue"]My point exactly but its his kit, not mine. I brought that up to him during the call and he was afraid of fire and such. I only showed him how to wire "his Kit". We can not argue that the circuit will work, its just a little overkill on relays. Besides, there are many instances where relays are used to feed relays, ect. Such as an example of the auto lamp circuit in our cars.[/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR]
Also, the way that is wired the starter would spin any time the button is pressed. It'd be better to feed it off the red/light green "RUN" wire off the ignition switch, as this would allow it only to spin the starter when the key is in "RUN".
[COLOR="blue"]And so will the starter when you rotate the key to start while the car is running.,, just dont push the button:D [/COLOR][/COLOR]
Vinnie, in response to your PM, you should connect the switch as follows:
Remove the lower steering column shroud to access the ignition switch wiring. This is the best place to pick up your power feeds, since you're going straight to the source.
RED (constant feed): Connect this to one of the thick yellow wires at the ignition switch YELLOW (switched 12V feed): Connect this to the red/light green stripe wire at the ignition switch WHITE: (start): Connect this to the red/light blue wire at the ignition switch. If you want to retain the START function in the ignition switch simply "T" into this wire. If you want to lose the start function of the ignition switch and make it so that you must use the button, cut the red/light blue wire and connect the starter button's white wire to the harness side of the cut. Tape the ignition side of the cut up so it can't short to anything. Personally, I'd keep the start function in the ignition switch, because constantly forgetting about that button would get old really quick...
[COLOR="blue"]the diagram allows that to happen, start is still in place in conjunction with the push button[/COLOR][/COLOR]
NOTE: You should install inline fuse holders in both the red (constant) and yellow (switched) and fuse both at no more than 10 amps.
[COLOR="blue"]the yellow wire has a 15A circuit protection,, this means its going to be a fused circuit identical to the neighboring stock wiring..[/COLOR]
If you tap into those ignition switch wires with no fuses it's as good as connecting directly to the battery, and could cause a fire if that starter button ever shorts out or if the wires you run ever chaffe on anything.[/COLOR]
[COLOR="Blue"]the yellow wire for his relay coil and contact has a fuse in line. Maybe I am misunderstanding you.[/COLOR]
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: Thunder Chicken on April 02, 2009, 11:14:30 PM
Scott, those feeds you mentioned aren't fused. If you look at the EVTM the yellow wire feeds that 15A fuse, not the other way around. The only protection on that yellow wire is a 16-gauge fusible link, which is way, way too big to protect that li'l starter button.
The last time I did a draw test on a Ford starter relay's coil circuit (back in trade school, on my '85 V6 Bird) it drew 150mA while cranking. That's not enough to put much of a load on any switch...
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: jcassity on April 02, 2009, 11:15:44 PM
Oppps Your right,,, that fuse is kicked sideways so to speak.
Vinnie, that yellow wire is simply passing across one post of the yellow wire fuse holder. If you zoom in on the fuse holder diagram, you see where the line passes through one post. This means its basically hot with only the fuse link as protection.
But humm,, wait,,, If the factory has no actual fuse,, then why bother fusing a start circuit that was never fused in the first place.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: Thunder Chicken on April 02, 2009, 11:35:23 PM
Good question, Scott. Now ask all the insurance companies who have paid for Fords burned by faulty ignition switches the same question :hick: (actually, it's usually the grey/yellow stripe wire circuit that shorts, but it's protected by the same fusible link)
This is one of the reasons I rewired the ignition switch in my car (the grey/yellow wire circuit is now seperated into three circuits, two with their own relays, one 75A relay feeding the heater, one 30A relay feeding the turn signals, and the cluster circuit is left alone). I've had one switch and harness burn ('91 T-Bird) and two almost catch fire (87 Sport and 88 'Bird). I also rewired my headlights with relays because I don't like the headlight switch carrying the current. Ford sucked at wiring back then.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: jcassity on April 02, 2009, 11:49:19 PM
we also discussed this, and since your saying the starter relay coil only draws 15% of an amp,, the push button should work without the relay since the amperage is low enough.
vinnie, i think this answers the unaswered question because id bet that push button is rated no less than 10A
you lost me here?> [COLOR="Red"]
Quote from: Thunder Chicken;265600
Scott, those feeds you mentioned aren't fused. If you look at the EVTM the yellow wire feeds that 15A fuse, not the other way around. QUOTE][/COLOR][/B]
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on April 03, 2009, 07:21:35 AM
So,if I use the relay,which I want to do,where do I go from here?I'm starting all over aren't I?
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on April 03, 2009, 07:22:16 AM
I knew this would be more confusing to me than I first realized.Two wires and I have no idea where they go.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: jcassity on April 03, 2009, 09:59:22 AM
Vinnie, your fine,,
just wire up like in either picture. Your pictures duplicate your existing start function.
I know you are dead set on using the relay and if thats what you want then drawing 1 is there to use.
If your interested in a better bang for your buck, get TC to layout a drawing that improves on the faults engineered to your existing start / run circuit.
either way, drawing 1 will work and drawing 2.
If you want fuse protection, just add it where your yellow wire taps are , perhaps using a circuit breaker fuse we talked about. I cant believe that starter realy coil only draws that little of current, I was thinking atleast 5A (based on absolutly nothing but an assumption). I would add fuse protection up at the yellow wire tap because this helps prevent damage. Using the circuit breaker type fuse is great because it resets so you basically cant go wrong.
TC- unconfuss the man will ya:D What he needs to see / hear is will the two above drawings work. Also, what you have said on your posts are great points and a more indepth approach.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on April 03, 2009, 04:43:12 PM
O.K.,JCassity,,I'm going outside to hook it up like we decided last night on the phone.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on April 03, 2009, 07:00:48 PM
Apparently I'm not installing it today.There are TWO yellow wires,and I didn't want to take any chances until I know for sure which one to use for the red and yellow push to start harness wires.I almost took the car to the auto electric place for them to hook it up.I guess I just don't get all of the hows and whys and details as well as I understand which one,and where.
Crazy,I built my entire car from a salvaged,ready to crush car,and can't figure this BS out.Man I'm pissed.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: Thunder Chicken on April 03, 2009, 07:05:56 PM
Did it come with instructions, or are there any schematics printed on it?
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on April 03, 2009, 07:33:30 PM
It came with instructions.
1.Red wire from relay to constant power (constant 12V in harness or directly to battery according to the instructions).
2.Yellow wire from relay to Ignition (12V when key is on)
3.White wire from relay to starter wire
4.Black wire from relay to connection on start button
5.second black wire from second connection on start button to chassis ground
jcassity took his time and patience to explain all this (much appreciation for that !!!),make a diagram,etc.,and apparently,over night,I lost all knowledge.I suppose I simply need to know what the hell wires to graft into,their colors,and where they are.
From what i think now,I know where the black wires go,easy enough.jcassity said that the yellow wire from the button relay goes to the second yellow wire on the igintion switch (second yellow wire being the one towards the middle).The white wire to the red wire with the blue stripe.He also said I could either hook the red wire (constant 12V) to the battery,or,tie it in with the button relay yellow wire to the yellow wire on the ignition switch in the column.I can't remember if it was the first or second yellow wire,but I think it was the second.I'd really rather ask a lot of dumb A$$ questions than fry anything.
Sorry for the confusion and continuation of all of this.It's simple stuff.....just not for me.....apparently.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on April 03, 2009, 09:18:49 PM
O.K. !!!! I talked to jcassity on the phone...again,and I do believe we have this all worked out.....I mean jcassity has it worked out,I'm just applying it to the Sport.
Man,I'm glad we have each other for help around here.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: jcassity on April 03, 2009, 09:21:44 PM
Quote from: vinnietbird;265714
From what i think now,.
I can totally relate,, had it happen today. I designed out a generator swap and hot slide of a 12kva UPS to our (to be installed) DC plant 50k Inverter,, forgot what the hell i did when I was doing it all paper last fall. We cant drop the site or sevice but still transition all this shiznit. customer wants the project, i gotta figure out what I did,so I can explain what to do to the installers.:D
98 project surveyed this year,, 44 active. my head hurts.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: Thunder Chicken on April 03, 2009, 09:29:40 PM
Vinnie, here is how to wire your starter button (I did not know until your PM that the switch came with a relay). Wiring it like this will allow the switch to only work when the ignition switch is in "RUN", like the manufacturer intended.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on April 04, 2009, 07:11:45 AM
Thanks Chicken.Now,this causes me confusion.2 paths to follow,but I only need one.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: Thunder Chicken on April 04, 2009, 11:55:07 AM
...and the one you need is in post #58 ;)
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: Kitz Kat on April 04, 2009, 01:57:43 PM
Or run the button hot to the solenoid, like was said in the beginning. Now your adding one more thing to go wrong, and you may not remember why or how it's wired. Plus you got splices all over, that if not done correctly will fail, and be a bitch.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: jcassity on April 04, 2009, 02:42:18 PM
Vinnie, both options have benefits,
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: jcassity on April 04, 2009, 02:59:47 PM
Quote from: Kitz Kat;265802
Or run the button hot to the solenoid, like was said in the beginning. Now your adding one more thing to go wrong, and you may not remember why or how it's wired. Plus you got splices all over, that if not done correctly will fail, and be a bitch.
He's just dead set on using the relay,, its a kit. Based on TC's measurements,,, its an option.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: jcassity on April 04, 2009, 03:13:10 PM
Quote from: Thunder Chicken;265600
The last time I did a draw test on a Ford starter relay's coil circuit (back in trade school, on my '85 V6 Bird) it drew 150mA while cranking. That's not enough to put much of a load on any switch...
FYI, I just did a test with my clamp on, the red light blue wire has 2.9A during crank using my Ideal 61-768. Power annylizer should show the inrush but thats overcomplicating simple stuff.:rollin:
Im sure the push button can handle that by way of just using the push button alone.
TC, is the red/lb wire what you tested in trade school,, ?
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: Thunder Chicken on April 04, 2009, 04:38:04 PM
Vinnie: You can ignore what I'm about to type here, because it's got little to do with the connections you need to make. Reading the mumbo-jumbo below will only serve to confuse you more. Simplify! Simplify!
Scott: The R/LG wire feeds everything that you want to have power during cranking AND running. This includes the ignition coil, gauge self-test circuit, etc. It is one of two RUN feeds from the ignition switch. The other is the large grey/yellow stripe wire I mentioned earlier (not shown in your diagram). That one feeds accessories you want to operate while running but NOT while cranking (blower motor, etc). This ensures full voltage to the starter and coil during cranking without some of those other accessories drawing (in the old days of ballast resistors it also would have bypassed the resistor in this position so the coil got full voltage). To see what I mean, go out to your car, turn on the fan and the wipers, turn the key to RUN, and note that everything is working. Now move the key to START and you'll notice that the wipers (which are on the ACC circuit) and heater (which are on the RUN circuit) momentarily stop while you're holding the key in "START". If you've got EATC the display should briefly go blank as well.
The ignition switch is very complicated. Don't think of it as a single switch, think of it as several switches together (multi-pole) that do different things depending on several possible positions (multi-throw). Each depiction of a switch inside the ignition switch assembly is indeed a seperate switch. The dotted line between the arrows (wipers) indicates that all of the wipers are mechanically (NOT electrically) connected. This simply means they all move at the same time when you turn the key - in other words, when you turn the key to "START" all of the switches inside the ignition switch are in the START position. The START position makes some connections (the one to the starter, the R/LB and BR/PK wires) and breaks others (the ACC and RUN- grey/yel feeds). There is also a ground-switch inside the ignition switch that feeds the "BULB TEST ground circuit during, and only during, START.
The red/light green wire and the brown/pink wire are the same point electrically regardless of the position of the ignition switch - you'll note that they are connected together at splice 129.
The START/IGN page of the ETM is not the place to look for ignition switch information. You should be looking at POWER DISTRIBUTION (I don't have my EVTM handy so I don't know what page it's on).
As for your thoughts about having a way to crank the engine without fuel/spark, Ford has already given us a way of doing so by mounting the starter relay right there on the fender. It's going to be far easier to use that point with a remote start button than it is to climb into the car every time you want to crank it. There are very few times, if any, that you'd ever want to crank the engine from inside the car without the intention of starting it. There are many times, however, where you won't want that switch active unless the key is in. Kids in the car is one example. Thieves in the car is another. Yes, the car won't start, but the battery will be killed from trying. And if the clutch switch was not installed correctly during the T5 swap the car could even take off and hit something.
All that being said, this arguing is making it very confusing for poor Vinnie, when it doesn't have to be. It's a simple circuit with only a few simple connections required, and overthinking it is not getting Vinnie any closer to having his magic button installed. My diagram above shows how the vendor of the switch kit intended it be installed. I stand by my recommendation that it be installed that way. Earlier in this thread, when I said no relay was required, I said so based on some not-clear info from Vinnie (He told me there were three coloured wires and some grounds, I assumed they all came from the switch, didn't know there was a switch and a relay).
As for the draw on the solenoid/relay: The test was done in 1993, on a light sage green V6 carbureted Thunderbird. The test was done by pulling the small connector off the relay, then jumping the battery directly to the terminal with the ammeter in series. That's about all I remember of it. I don't even remember what the teacher was trying to prove with this test (I think it had something to do with "pull in" VS "hold in" windings).
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: jcassity on April 04, 2009, 05:00:54 PM
Quote from: Thunder Chicken;265813
All that being said, this arguing .
I tried and failed at hoping you werent thinking like that.. You said you enjoy this kind of stuff, so do i. Lack of voice on hand here on the net makes my wording look bad i guess.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on April 04, 2009, 05:03:59 PM
I never saw you two arguing,just different ideas on the same subject.We are all good.
Confused................yes I am.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: Thunder Chicken on April 04, 2009, 05:23:21 PM
Scott, I meant no disrespect with what I said, I was simply trying to get this wrapped up for Vinnie's sake. I didn't mean "argument" in the Red VS Blue sense, I just meant that we're giving him much more information than he needs, and the unneeded information is pushing the needed information out of his head :hick:
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on April 04, 2009, 05:28:40 PM
Quote from: Thunder Chicken;265821
I just meant that we're giving him much more information than he needs, and the unneeded information is pushing the needed information out of his head :hick:
This is true.LOL.I had quite a few confusing looks on my face reading all of this. Gayle (my woman) asked if I was alright at one point.I said "read this"......she said "Oh,I see".LOL.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on April 04, 2009, 07:01:54 PM
O.K !!!!!! I was hooking up the wires for the push to start button,and of course,SOMETHING has to screw up.All of the sudden,my stereo came on with the key out,and won't go off (I had to disconnect the battery).I disconnected the wires I hooked up for the button,and no change.There's a little black and pink wire with a plastic clip that looks as though it goes to where the key cylinder is that broke off at the plastic clip.What the F is this for?This is really g me off.I should have known.What would cause the stereo to stay on ??? I can't find any wires that look like they are shorting out or touching anything they shouldn't.I didn't touch any wires under the dash that go to the stereo.Now,Every time I stop the car,I have to disconnect the battery to get out.All because I couldn't figure out two friggin' wires.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: Thunder Chicken on April 04, 2009, 07:28:49 PM
Try unplugging your ignition switch, Vinnie, and see what happens. There is the chance that the switch was about to fail and it just did. Also check the plug on the switch to see if it's burned or distorted. I've actually seen this happen before. If you unplug the ignition switch and the radio goes out, DO NOT PLUG IT IN AGAIN. Get a new switch immediately.
If you tapped into the wires given above you can't power up the radio - it's on the "ACC" circuit, not the "RUN" circuit. The black wire is connected to the "key in" switch and causes the car to make that annoying sound when you're trying to listen to the radio with the door open.
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on April 04, 2009, 07:52:37 PM
I got it,I got it !!! One of the yellow wires (the big ones) came out of the ignition plug (The one on the corner).I plugged it back in in the corner,but the wrong one.I put it back next to the other yellow wire,and WOO-HOO !!!!!!!,everything is as it should be,push to start is a GO,and all is back together.I need to clean up the car and take some pics now.
I owe you and jcassity (Scott Man) a large THANK YOU !!!! You guys came in and took the time to help out and find out what I needed to know when you didn't have to at all.THANK YOU again.You guys stepped up and RAWK !!!!
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: Thunder Chicken on April 04, 2009, 07:57:56 PM
Excellent. Enjoy your shiny new button :D
Title: My new dash panel......
Post by: vinnietbird on April 04, 2009, 08:50:04 PM
Thanks a lot.One more project finished.On to the trunk.............