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Messages - DiamondSCattleCo

2
Electrical Tech / Singing the alternator blues
Well, back to the drawing board.  Had to re-hook the ABS wires as they also control the brake boost.  But now I think I'm seeing a pattern, especially since I saw some harebrained wiring the previous owner had done.

When I fire up the car, brake booster completely drained, the alternator charges normally.  Once the brakes come up, the charge drops rapidly.  This brings us to the harebrained wiring I saw.  Apparently the high/low pressure switch must have quit working, so the previous owner direct wired the booster.

Sooo, current theory is once the booster comes up to max pressure, the little electric motor on the hydraulic booster starts drawing a pile of current, pulling down the 2G alternator.  Any comments on the theory?  Any idea how much current that hydraulic booster is supposed to pull?

Rod
3
Suspension/Steering / 1987 Tbird Braking Issue
I have a 1987 TBird 2.3L Turbocharged.  Its got that goofy electric brake booster on it, which appears to be non-functional now.  The hi-low pressure switch quit working, so the previous owner direct wired it.  As of this morning, it appears to have blown out the booster, probably due to overpressure.

Questions:
1) I can't find a jobber part.  Ford dealer says they can't get one anymore.  Anyone have a source for them?  Both the booster and the high/low switch.

2) Can I convert from the ABS/Power booster to a manual booster/master cylinder setup?  Anyone know if the stock brake rod is the right length/diameter to work the manual booster?  Does the 4 cylinder create enough vacuum to properly run a booster?

Thanks in advance.

Rod
4
Electrical Tech / Singing the alternator blues
Quote from: softtouch;254127
That must an antique Dodge you are talking about. Back to the 6v days.


Well I suppose it may be antique to some of young fellas, but this goes back to the 60s and 12 volt systems.

Rod
5
Electrical Tech / Singing the alternator blues
Got the dirty bugger!  At least I think so :)

Turned out to be the ABS system.  The ABS system has never worked since I bought the car, so tonight I got torqued off and clipped the tan/red and tan/yellow ABS power wires to completely eliminate the system.  Well I got torqued off after trying to get into the trunk to unplug the ABS control module.  Just too doggoned big to fit back there.

For the first time since I've started the whole alternator replacement thing, I had a solid 14.4-14.5 at the battery at idle.  When I turned everything on (lights, fan, etc), voltage dropped to 13.4 but stayed right there versus slowly dropping to 11.4 like it used to. I'm going to load test it tomorrow as I may have burnt some of the windings out on the new one already.  Alternator gets warm, but not smoking hot like it used to.

When I get around to fully restoring the car, I'll re-hook and figure out just what exactly is wrong with the ABS system.  I've had ABS relays and control modules go bad on other vehicles, but never had one that would dead short the charging system.  Very odd.

So thank you all very much for the help.  It was much appreciated, and I will be doing the 3G (or maybe the 6G) conversion soon, after I make sure I've got my issues taken care of.

Rod
6
Electrical Tech / Singing the alternator blues
Quote from: V8Demon;254036
So it basically works like the stock oil gauge then?  LOL.


This brings up something odd I noticed about my car.  When my temperature rises, so does my oil pressure.  Working kinda bass-ackwards, isn't it?
7
Electrical Tech / Singing the alternator blues
I need to get more sleep.  It dawned on me that of course I'd have continuity from the alternator power wires to the body:  Anything with constant power like a clock will complete the circuit. :(

Rod8
8
Electrical Tech / Singing the alternator blues
lol, Well, don't buy what I'm sellin'.  I tossed in a 3623 SE into an S-184-1 alternator we had in stock.  Yanked the old 2G out, and slapped in the new Delco.  And ran into a major catch: The body of a Delco, while its the exact same diameter as a 2G or 3G, doesn't have the "dent" on the side of the alternator where a regulator sits on a 2G.  So the alternator body contacts the doggoned alternator mount.  I'd have to lift the bottom mount up about an inch to get the body to clear.

So, long story short, switch to a 3G or other, lol.  I'm probably still going to do it, but not until I get some other issues sorted out.

So I've still got a dead short somewhere.  When I got done swearing over the Delco swap, I grabbed my continuity tester and just out of curiosity, tested continuity between the black/orange alt power wires and the body.  Of course it started buzzing, so I've got a dead short somewhere, and it must be on an unprotected circuit, as I don't have any fuses blown.  There are only four things not functioning properly in the car:
1) brake booster
2) ABS
3) electric fans
4) ammeter

I pulled the dash tonight and unplugged the wiring harness into the back of the gauge cluster.  My short didn't go away, so apparently its not like the old Dodge trucks of yesteryear (the ammeters would burn out and the alternator would quite charging).

I see from the EVTM that the black/orange wire splits into the ABS power leads by the starter relay, so I guess I'll start there tomorrow.

On a side note, has anyone found a decent power distribution centre to replace the dog's breakfast of fusible links and splices?  Whoever designed that whole mess under the starter relay really needed to find another job, lol.
9
Electrical Tech / Singing the alternator blues
Thanks for the suggestions y'all.  Gonna check them all out after work.

I did have a chance to look through the EVTM, and noticed that the black/orange wires run through the Ammeter, same as they did on old Dodges.  Since my ammeter doesn't work, I'm wondering if the link wire that bypasses the ammeter is also hooped?  I'm going to go on a hunt for it anyway.

Today at lunch I'm running a pair of 6 gauge wires from the black/orange wires over to the starter solenoid.  We'll see if we finally get some charging without destroying the alternator.

Now I've got what may be a dumb question.  Why is it no-one has bothered to do a Delco conversion?  Much better alternators than the 3Gs that you guys are all over. 

I checked one of our 100A 10S framed Delcos and they'd be a great fit.  All that would be needed is a spacer on the bottom mount and it would fit right up.  You can put a 3623 SE self exciting regulator in it, run a 4 gauge wire over to the starter solenoid.  Hook the black/orange wires up to the hot lead coming from the alternator, eliminate the other three plug in leads as the alternator is self exciting and internally regulated.  We switch ag tractors from Motorolas/Nippondensos over to Delcos all the time.  Much tougher, and much cheaper.  You'd be hard pressed to convince me there is a better alternator.

Rod
10
Electrical Tech / Singing the alternator blues
Ok, read the fire thread.  Not really seeing anything there that pertains to my situation, although I am ready to watch for gotchas when I'm doing the 3G install.

But before I do the 3G install, I think I should find where my current issue is before throwing 130 amps at the car.  While I realize the 2G alternators aren't great, there is an issue somewhere when a new alternator can't provide more than 12.9 volts.

Rod
11
Electrical Tech / Singing the alternator blues
I've got the 3G alternator swap all printed out and ready to rock, JCassity.  Thanks.  I was going to do it today when the old alternator bit the dust, but my supplier didn't have a 3G in stock and I live 11 miles out of town.  Hadda git home :)

I'll check out the fire thread.  Thanks.

Dominator:  Sorry, should have mentioned it.  I removed the butt ugly bolt on clamps today and went with brand spankin' new solder ons.  Nary a bad clamp or terminal to be found.  Cleaned all the wires with soldering paste before stuffing them into the new clamps.

Rod
12
Electrical Tech / Singing the alternator blues
I haven't, but that doesn't mean that someone else hasn't.  Where should I be looking for fusible links?  On the black/orange wires?  I noticed some fusible links in my EVTM, but it didn't look to me like they were connected to alternator anywhere.
13
Electrical Tech / Singing the alternator blues
I should also mention that the ammeter in the car NEVER shows a charging situation.  Anything common on the gauge cluster that shorts out?
14
Electrical Tech / Singing the alternator blues
I have an 87 T-Bird 2.3L turbo that eats 2G alternators at a prodigious rate (1 per week).  I've obviously got some kind of dead short somewhere as its burning out the windings, but I'll be ed if I can find it even though I've visually inspected just about every wire in the vehicle.  I thought I had it beat last time (bad ground clamp), but she chewed up another alternator today and the replacement I put on this afternoon is already running very warm.  With the vehicle idling, I'm getting about 13.4 volts, 12.9 with the headlights on.  But the alternator will get smoking hot after running for about 2 minutes.

There is no battery drain when the vehicle is off, so I know I don't have a short on a non-protected circuit.  I would have thought that a dead short on a protected circuit would blow a fuse.  Starter solenoid isn't sticking on, and otherwise appears to be working well.  Today I ran a ground wire from the alternator body to the battery negative terminal, just in case the engine wasn't grounding properly.

So I'm beat.  Where are my best spots to start looking for the culprit?  I looked for bare or broken wires, but didn't see anything.  Of course, I could have missed it too.  Bad ignition module cause this issue?

Thanks in advance for any help.

Rod
15
Electrical Tech / Different charging issue and some other problems
Quote from: jcassity;245294
your bosch pump is about 65Lph, the super charged 3.8 is 90Lph and offers a huge improvement over stock at a cost effective price.


Direct bolt-in?  Do I need to change the whole assembly over, or just the pump?

Rod