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88 sport rebuild , need advice

July 05, 2013, 09:55:46 AM

moving this thread to proper location.........

ive got 550$ in this now....... a 1997 ford explorer motor.
i do have questions below and need advise for parts collection

*********need HO cam
*********need help on what size injectors,, explorer i think have 34lb but thats too much fuel i believe
*********need to udnerstand how to get a hold of a steel dizzy gear if i use an ho cam!! help!  do i need a steel dizzy gear or not?
*********can i go with a MarkVII fuel pump or SC 3.8L pump?  has stock fuel pump i think



I purchased the whole engine, it resides on thier warehouse shelf fully complete minus only the starter, alternator and airconditioning., came from a rear ended exploder i believe,, can confirm,,
The yard runs each engine to verify operation prior to shelving and put up for sale.
price included cost of motor plus delivery to my garage 33 miles away.

so,, here is our current set up.
pls keep in mind that this build will help feed another build for my youngest son Chance when we put a decent engine together for my white coug.



Car is 88 bird sport, with what i believe has *got* to be e7 heads, stock bottom end, explorer uper and lower, BBK 65mm TB, 14LB injectors, stock computer.

option 1:
explorer motor delievers and i tear down and decide what machine work needs done.
have block punched and line bored if needed pending condition of interior parts i see.
it is likely i will have the shop punch out 30over bores.
do std size short block rebuild with possible 30over pistons
when mason gets home, we will remove his engine, swap on his existing explorer upper / lower / bbk TB he got for christmas
mason gets the explorer iron heads
remove his 14lb injectors for a set of 19lb set tom bryant sold me a long while back.
use the headers from my newly purched explorer motor
button things up and call it good.

option 2
add 331 stroker kit to bottom end with 30over pistons
do std size bearing kit if all is well.
mason now gets the explorer iron heads
swap over mason existing upper/lower intake he got for christmas and the bbk 65mm tb






end result
Chance gets a ready 5.0 block, with bottom end parts, Explorer upper , lower and tb, E7 heads, BBK headers i have on hand, gets him ahead of the game and my 550$ spent gets good use. I have a 5.0 wire harness lined up but i have to pay real well for it , have I hope at least two oil pans lined up....got a few pms to answer.

this is all going on in about 30days from now with mason taking a week vacation. (masons build that is)

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88 sport rebuild , need advice

Reply #1 – July 05, 2013, 10:22:07 AM

if anyone can call me it would be nice.
i want to make  sure we have all the right parts to do this in the short duration of time and slowly enough to where we can use all the time to do it right.

304 772 3411 or 4082,, ask for scott
 
much appreciated.

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88 sport rebuild , need advice

Reply #2 – July 05, 2013, 12:44:10 PM

Finding time to call is difficult, apologies for not responding quickly to your PM. 
If it's a late 97 engine, it will have 19# injectors, gt40p heads, and external egr.  You'll know for sure if the EGR valve has a steel pipe from it to the right side exhaust manifold.  For this you WILL want P head headers with an EGR pipe fitting on it, and you WILL have to keep the 90 degree turn adapter on it.  You'll want to transfer the BBK 65mm unit as it will have the right quadrant on it and you'll have to make a bracket to adapt the throttle and TV cables bracket to fit in the new location. You'll need to make a new inlet pipe.  You'll have to use a pre-OBD2 external feed EGR valve, probably from an F-150 because the Explorer EGR valve will not have a provision to mount the EVP sensor on it. 
In either case, transfer the HO cam and the dizzy together, then you don't have to care about the dizzy gear.  Make sure you're running an HO PCM such as from a Mark VII.  I also recommend using the Explorer accessory drive components unless you can eliminate the oil cooler.  Otherwise the long nose water pump  accessory drive system will not line up properly with the coolant outlet on the oil cooler and you'll have to get "creative" hosing the water pump and the oil cooler together (ask me how I know).  This presents new hurdles.  The alternator isn't a problem, but the power steering pump will need new hoses made to fit and a bracket to mount the reservoir on.  Not a huge hump either, but the Explorer AC compressor will need a new manifold and pipes assembly made that will attach to the car and the new style compressor, and THAT will be a touch more difficult.  Or you can get creative like I did, and I can send you pics of my solution. 
If you're dealing with an early 97 engine, things are much easier.  You still already have 19# injectors and you only have to swap the cam and dizzy, then decide which way to go with the accessory drive, the EGR from an HO engine can carry over directly, as can the associated bracketry.  One last thing to note, if you have an early upper and lower intake, use it.  It doesn't cause the same clearance issues with the HO valve covers AND while it still doesn't have a pre-drilled port for the egr cooler or the air charge temp sensor, it does have nice flat places to drill and tap for them.  The later intake has a slightly lower plenum and no port bosses to drill out.  I learned the hard way to not even think about relocating the sensor to a cooler location.

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88 sport rebuild , need advice

Reply #3 – July 05, 2013, 12:47:56 PM

http://www.sbftech.com/

Scott, there's a bunch of good info here and some really knowledgeable people.

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88 sport rebuild , need advice

Reply #4 – July 05, 2013, 02:21:01 PM

i kinda lost me or you lost me Foe,
i dont have an HO cam
Are you saying I must convert to HO EEC?
for 331 stroker wouldnt i need more fuel

i better learn to not type so much stuff  and ask questions one at a time.  LOL

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88 sport rebuild , need advice

Reply #5 – July 05, 2013, 02:23:18 PM

maybe i should take this one question at a time so i dont screw up my parts list.

first question
what injectors would be recommended for a 331 kit based on this cars current setup?

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88 sport rebuild , need advice

Reply #6 – July 05, 2013, 02:25:17 PM

I guess I just sort of assumed you had one since you said you had e7 heads. I would say that yes you need an HO PCM either way you do it.  And if you want to run larger injectors you'll need a J3 port module that you can flash with a custom calibration. I THINK.

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88 sport rebuild , need advice

Reply #7 – July 05, 2013, 02:30:55 PM

The injector size for a 331 is going to depend on the heads and the cam.  With gt40 heads and any kind of stock cam, 19's are probably fine. Maybe 24's, tops.  I've heard that the speed density PCM's don't play nice with injector swaps, maybe someone who has done it will know better.

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88 sport rebuild , need advice

Reply #8 – July 05, 2013, 03:55:23 PM

the heads will be iron GT40's on this motor which is a 97explorer.
mason has the explorer upper/lower/bbk spacer(incorrect info from me above) / I believe an explorer TB


We want an HO cam
I was under the impression i woulnt have to swap in an HO eec just yet,, wouldnt that require mass air meter?

if we stay stock crank kit thats fine

if we go 331 we do need more fuel i thought?

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88 sport rebuild , need advice

Reply #9 – July 05, 2013, 06:43:37 PM

The Explorer motor can already approach the limits of 19lb injectors at 302ci. I'd start with 24lb injector if you went 331. With my car tuned for a 12.5:1 AFR, I washiznitting 100% duty cycle on the 19lb injectors at 5k rpms. This was basically a stock rebuilt shortblock, gt40 heads, gt40-based intake, HO cam, and 65mm tb/dual 2.5" exhaust. I'm not sure the SO computer can deal with 19lb injectors without a custom tune.

I think you should just go 19lb/HO cam/speed density HO EEC (87/88, direct replacement), and then if you prefer, you could switch to mass air. You'd need a 90lph or greater fuel pump to keep up with 19lb injectors. 120lph or greater would support 24lb injectors.

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88 sport rebuild , need advice

Reply #10 – July 05, 2013, 08:05:14 PM

HO cam will require HO computer as the firing order is different. If you going to buy an EEC anyways, you may as well go ahead and buy a MAF EEC because you will eventually need it, and there is no need in buying two. Get a MAF sensor, MAF EEC, and the MAF plug. if you shop around it shouldn't cost more than $125.

Don't buy the MAF conversion kit, as all it is is a plug with wire. you can get the same thing from a junkyard for $5 tops

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88 sport rebuild , need advice

Reply #11 – July 05, 2013, 09:28:45 PM

Someone with jcassity's level of expertise could stick with speed density and use a flashable J3 port module like a tweecer or Moates quarterhorse and actually run faster.  The only advantage MAF has is flexibility, and it comes at a cost.  On a stock crank run 19's as a 331, run 24's.  If your long term goals are stratospheric, run 24's on the stock crank and 36's on the 331.  In any case, you probably need software work to run over 19#.

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88 sport rebuild , need advice

Reply #12 – July 05, 2013, 11:43:55 PM

Scott i have a ho cam if you want it. Just pay shipping

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88 sport rebuild , need advice

Reply #13 – July 05, 2013, 11:50:54 PM

if you.go.mass air, you can.buy a mass air unit calibrated for the injectors, then you won't need a tune.

on sd, you'll need a tune for 24 or higher injectors. many sd.systems make more power and are simpler then mass.air. mass air will do better with modifications, but short of a super charger or really hot.cam, I don't you'll notice a difference.

order the fuel pump for a stang. just the fuel pump. it works fine with your stock hanger assembly. bigger is better, and little cost difference. stay away from airtek pumps. open the box at the parts store, and find a boshe stamp.

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88 sport rebuild , need advice

Reply #14 – July 05, 2013, 11:51:25 PM

if you.go.mass air, you can.buy a mass air unit calibrated for the injectors, then you won't need a tune.

on sd, you'll need a tune for 24 or higher injectors. many sd.systems make more power and are simpler then mass.air. mass air will do better with modifications, but short of a super charger or really hot.cam, I don't you'll notice a difference.

order the fuel pump for a stang. just the fuel pump. it works fine with your stock hanger assembly. bigger is better, and little cost difference. stay away from airtek pumps. open the box at the parts store, and find a boshe stamp.

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