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Topic: ###!**** fuel pump.....running again !!! (Read 3424 times) previous topic - next topic

###!**** fuel pump.....running again !!!

Reply #15 –
I am an electrical contractor. You should be able to probe the wires for power for as long as needed. The only way you wouldn't have power is if the pump were connected and it built up pressure IIRC.

###!**** fuel pump.....running again !!!

Reply #16 –
Well obviously I should have read page two before I posted. I am sure you didn't mean to sound rude. You obviously meant to insult me. I was simply trying to help someone with a problem and you consider any advice I gave him polluted. It was not polluted. It is a very common term that is used all the time. I promise not to help anymore. Sorry my advice was useless. As far as chevy not using the wire color I described, call the dealer near you and see what they say. This is the exact reason I don't work on vehicles as a profession anymore. You try to do the right thing and help someone out and of course there would be someone lying in wait to come along and flame you cause they don't like what you have to say. Well enough of soapboxing.

###!**** fuel pump.....running again !!!

Reply #17 –
@speedemon(don't give up on me, I appreciate any help)...allright, my son and I checked the power going to the pump(right at the pump plug), checked with the old trusty 12v light thingy(got power for the first 2-3 sec, prime time).
  We then checked the voltage (key on) with a volt meter and got a .30 reading?? is this right?? we checked all the wires going to the pump and they all LOOK in great shape, they aren't cracked, broke, or even fragile at all, the underneath is very clean. I did notice when we took the pump out that the plug going right into the pump itself wasn't all the way locked, pushed it in and still nothing. Took the pump out and bench tested and she was DEAD!!
  @jcassity,,,,I will try all your info tomorrow(thanks for your help, you are the electro man!!), I did try probing the pump ralay(yellow wire) the other day with a 12v light(watchamacallit)and there was consant power, but i didn't check the voltage, I will try this tomorrow also(should it be 12????volts??)
  It just seems funny that i never had this problem untill my son and I put in the (1st) new pump, the tank has never been down before this(as far as i know).

Thanks again guys for all the help so far, i REALLY want to drive this thing again,like NOW!!!!!
88 sport,TW heads, comp xe270hr, cobra u/Tmoss ported lower, 65 mm throttle body, under drives,smog delete,
1.7 roller rockers, cai, k&n, bbk adj regulator, 76mm Pro-m,all MSD ign. MSD dist,18° base timing, 3g alt.1 5/8 ceramic headers, 255lph walbro, 2.5" h-pipe, flowmasters, silverfox valvebody, 3.73 gear,
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc154/flipnbird/DSCF0185.jpg ( RIP : ( )

###!**** fuel pump.....running again !!!

Reply #18 –
Flipnbird, When you tested the leads at the plug. was that with a digital multimeter(voltmeter)? What was the meter set to? Was it set to voltage or was it on another seting such as ohms? If you had your meter set to DC(direct current) voltage and you received a reading of 0.30 volts and the meter was set to (as the meters that I use) 20 volt setting then NO that would be a bad voltage reading. If your meter also has a 200 volt DC setting then that would mean on the 20 volt DC setting(if your meter has that) it would have read 3.0 volts DC. This would still indicate to ME that you have a wiring issue. I could be completely "wrong" about this though. If you want to, I will PM you with my cell number and we could discuss this more in depth without any confusion in terms stemming from vocabulary discrepencies. Let me know.

###!**** fuel pump.....running again !!!

Reply #19 –
Quote from: flipnbird;232300
@speedemon(don't give up on me, I appreciate any help)...allright, my son and I checked the power going to the pump(right at the pump plug), checked with the old trusty 12v light thingy(got power for the first 2-3 sec, prime time).
  We then checked the voltage (key on) with a volt meter and got a .30 reading?? is this right?? we checked all the wires going to the pump and they all LOOK in great shape, they aren't cracked, broke, or even fragile at all, the underneath is very clean. I did notice when we took the pump out that the plug going right into the pump itself wasn't all the way locked, pushed it in and still nothing. Took the pump out and bench tested and she was DEAD!!
  @jcassity,,,,I will try all your info tomorrow(thanks for your help, you are the electro man!!), I did try probing the pump ralay(yellow wire) the other day with a 12v light(watchamacallit)and there was consant power, but i didn't check the voltage, I will try this tomorrow also(should it be 12????volts??)
  It just seems funny that i never had this problem untill my son and I put in the (1st) new pump, the tank has never been down before this(as far as i know).

Thanks again guys for all the help so far, i REALLY want to drive this thing again,like NOW!!!!!


you forgot to do one thing,, you forgot to make the pump run full time and thats why you got no power or .3v for a reading.  the ground to the fuel pump relay was removed by the eec at 3-5sec.

now go back with a jumper wire and do the full time test.  once that is done, you can test.

as for the power and your asking if it should be 12v.....?
Not once did i mention 12 volts.  I said that your reading on the yellow wire at the starter solenoid will be your "standard" or your reference voltage.


speeddemon-
he said he checked with a volt meter,, and judging from he exact reference to a .30v its highly unlikely anyone would be able to interpert an buttstuffog meter reading to that level of exactness unless like you said, he was set on the DCVx1 scale.

sorry i pissed you off but terminology means the difference between good enough and dead on.  I doubt you will find anyone in the electrical industry (like me) using odd wording like that.  If you worked on one of my projects and told me you had an open short, i would know right off the bat my problems were bigger than i thought.  I was going to cut you slack until you said you were an electrical contractor,, tighten up and learn your jargin, its an important characteristic of the service you represent.  Use that wireing diagram i posted and help this guy out,, its a pretty easy circuit to follow.  You cant see on the diagram but the inertia switch gets its power directly from a splice which originates from eec relay.

###!**** fuel pump.....running again !!!

Reply #20 –
Quote from: flipnbird;232300
@speedemon(don't give up on me, I appreciate any help)...allright, my son and I checked the power going to the pump(right at the pump plug), checked with the old trusty 12v light thingy(got power for the first 2-3 sec, prime time).
  We then checked the voltage (key on) with a volt meter and got a .30 reading?? is this right?? we checked all the wires going to the pump and they all LOOK in great shape, they aren't cracked, broke, or even fragile at all, the underneath is very clean. I did notice when we took the pump out that the plug going right into the pump itself wasn't all the way locked, pushed it in and still nothing. Took the pump out and bench tested and she was DEAD!!
  @jcassity,,,,I will try all your info tomorrow(thanks for your help, you are the electro man!!), I did try probing the pump ralay(yellow wire) the other day with a 12v light(watchamacallit)and there was consant power, but i didn't check the voltage, I will try this tomorrow also(should it be 12????volts??)
  It just seems funny that i never had this problem untill my son and I put in the (1st) new pump, the tank has never been down before this(as far as i know).

Thanks again guys for all the help so far, i REALLY want to drive this thing again,like NOW!!!!!



ok,, i know you have a problem and we are trying to help but when you reply back with missing detail, its hard to understand.  I make zero assumptions and per your answer:
"We then checked the voltage (key on) with a volt meter and got a .30 reading?? is this right?? "

Where did you check for voltage?

so,, id think the best way to answer all the items listed is to print out my post and ink in your answer.

next, come back on here, quote my post and insert your answers.  that will help the best.

###!**** fuel pump.....running again !!!

Reply #21 –
I am not trying to start a fight with anyone. I would like to help this guy out with his problem. I didn't mean to get nasty with you but I am having one hell of a time with this car that I bought from a "friend". I am sure you know what I mean. As far as my terminology is concerned, my proffessor at Penn State used those terms with us about ten years ago. Since aparently he used off the wall terms what would the correct nomenclature of those conditions be? I am being serious when I ask you this. You are never to old to learn something new. I have never had anyone before comment on my use of "open" and "hot" short. Actually now that I think of it everyone that I have worked with in this area uses those terms. Maybe it is just the locale. Who knows. Anyhow back to the problem at hand. Lets get this guys car running again.

###!**** fuel pump.....running again !!!

Reply #22 –
Jcassity, I was asking him about what his meter was set to since he coud be using some off the wall brand(Harbor Freight) meter. I have seen those meters used by kids at Circuit City and such and noticed that they had very weird settings on them. Not standardized at all. I use fluke meters and have even found them to be off before. I don't know why they were and won't venture a guess either. I was trying to simplify the settings for him as well since I am assuming(I know) that since he referred to a test light as a "whatchamacalit" that he is not adept to doing electrical repairs.  Lets get him up and running again shall we.

###!**** fuel pump.....running again !!!

Reply #23 –
oh im dead sure flipnbird knows what he's doing.  hes been around these cars for a long time.  he knows darn well im an ahole sometimes when details are needed.

to answer your question, an "open" and a "short" can not occupy the space in time.  Its either open or short or an intermittant open but never an "open short"
There are leaky circuits that happen but those are special instances and rarely do they occure where a breaker or fuse is not blown in a reasonable time.

It grips my ass everytime i hear someone say,, "i dont have power,, there must be short somewhere".  I say,, "no, you must have an open somewhere if the fuse/breaker is still good or set"

people need to understand that the word "short" is the last thing you want and typically starts fires.

###!**** fuel pump.....running again !!!

Reply #24 –
Quote from: jcassity;232333
you forgot to do one thing,, you forgot to make the pump run full time and thats why you got no power or .3v for a reading.  the ground to the fuel pump relay was removed by the eec at 3-5sec.

Yes I did forget to do this and I will try again

now go back with a jumper wire and do the full time test.  once that is done, you can test.

as for the power and your asking if it should be 12v.....?
Not once did i mention 12 volts.  I said that your reading on the yellow wire at the starter solenoid will be your "standard" or your reference voltage.

I gotcha on this one and I will also check this reading and go from there. which i take it that whatever that reading is(at the starter selonoid) my readings at the pump shoul read the same??


speeddemon-
he said he checked with a volt meter,, and judging from he exact reference to a .30v its highly unlikely anyone would be able to interpert an buttstuffog meter reading to that level of exactness unless like you said, he was set on the DCVx1 scale.

my meter is an older Tenma digital meter and I had it set on volt/DC when I took my reading which was right at the plug that hooks into the pump. I am not really top notch when it comes to what to set my meter on and reading these meters but i will give it my best when i have you electrical gurus to show me.

Thanks guys
88 sport,TW heads, comp xe270hr, cobra u/Tmoss ported lower, 65 mm throttle body, under drives,smog delete,
1.7 roller rockers, cai, k&n, bbk adj regulator, 76mm Pro-m,all MSD ign. MSD dist,18° base timing, 3g alt.1 5/8 ceramic headers, 255lph walbro, 2.5" h-pipe, flowmasters, silverfox valvebody, 3.73 gear,
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc154/flipnbird/DSCF0185.jpg ( RIP : ( )

###!**** fuel pump.....running again !!!

Reply #25 –
sorry,,, double post
88 sport,TW heads, comp xe270hr, cobra u/Tmoss ported lower, 65 mm throttle body, under drives,smog delete,
1.7 roller rockers, cai, k&n, bbk adj regulator, 76mm Pro-m,all MSD ign. MSD dist,18° base timing, 3g alt.1 5/8 ceramic headers, 255lph walbro, 2.5" h-pipe, flowmasters, silverfox valvebody, 3.73 gear,
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc154/flipnbird/DSCF0185.jpg ( RIP : ( )

###!**** fuel pump.....running again !!!

Reply #26 –
so,, id think the best way to answer all the items listed is to print out my post and ink in your answer.

next, come back on here, quote my post and insert your answers.  that will help the best.[/QUOTE]

I am printing these out as we speak,,,,Thanks
88 sport,TW heads, comp xe270hr, cobra u/Tmoss ported lower, 65 mm throttle body, under drives,smog delete,
1.7 roller rockers, cai, k&n, bbk adj regulator, 76mm Pro-m,all MSD ign. MSD dist,18° base timing, 3g alt.1 5/8 ceramic headers, 255lph walbro, 2.5" h-pipe, flowmasters, silverfox valvebody, 3.73 gear,
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc154/flipnbird/DSCF0185.jpg ( RIP : ( )

###!**** fuel pump.....running again !!!

Reply #27 –
Quote from: flipnbird;232378
.

I gotcha on this one and I will also check this reading and go from there. which i take it that whatever that reading is(at the starter selonoid) my readings at the pump shoul read the same??



yes, but note your voltage may drop a little due to the volage drop across the wiring which is normal.  Look closer at any reading 1.5v less than your standard.

###!**** fuel pump.....running again !!!

Reply #28 –
@jcassitty- got all my readings, as per your earlier post-----------

voltage-starter selonoid=12.3
voltage-yellow wire at fuel pump relay=11.93
voltage- red wire fuel pump relay input(from inertia switch)=11.93
voltage- pink/black wire(relay output to fuel pump in)=11.93
voltage- input to the inertia switch(red)=11.89
voltage- output of the inertia switch(red)=11.89
I also checked the voltage at the plug that goes into the pump=11.93

make sure no power exists on the tan/light green wire,,,,where(pump relay?, at the self test/ without ground?/or with?)---- also how do i check for resistance from the tan/light green to frame?(what shoud i set my meter on for a resistance reading)??

Thanks so much for all the help, Joe
88 sport,TW heads, comp xe270hr, cobra u/Tmoss ported lower, 65 mm throttle body, under drives,smog delete,
1.7 roller rockers, cai, k&n, bbk adj regulator, 76mm Pro-m,all MSD ign. MSD dist,18° base timing, 3g alt.1 5/8 ceramic headers, 255lph walbro, 2.5" h-pipe, flowmasters, silverfox valvebody, 3.73 gear,
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc154/flipnbird/DSCF0185.jpg ( RIP : ( )

###!**** fuel pump.....running again !!!

Reply #29 –
Quote from: flipnbird;232425


make sure no power exists on the tan/light green wire,,,,where(pump relay?, at the self test/ without ground?/or with?)---- also how do i check for resistance from the tan/light green to frame?(what shoud i set my meter on for a resistance reading)??

Thanks so much for all the help, Joe


actually , the more i think about it the more i realize my fingers got ahead of my brain on that one.  If you check for power on the tan light green wire to ground, your just going to run your pump full time.  its the same point electrically as the eec self test conn where you pull codes.



So if you pulled your readings with the tan light green grounded out, it appears all is well with power delivery of your fuel pump circuit.

Did the pump run with the Key on and the TAN/ LightGreen wire grounded ?
You can ground this wire back at the fuel pump relay also just by probing it with a stick pin and gator clip it to chassis ground or........ ground it up at the eec self test conn.

If your are able to get the pump to run with the tan light green grounded at the fuel pump relay but not at the eec self test connector, then the wire is broken either up at the eec self test path or more likely the path leading up to the EEC.

Your first complaint was you could not hear the pump prime at all,, did you hear it run?