Building A System August 25, 2006, 06:21:35 PM Time for an upgrade. Give me your opinions. Here is what I'm considering:AMD Athlon 64 X2 4200+ASRock 939 Dual SATA-2 motherboardWent with this because it has both AGP and PCIe slots and I just bought an ATI 9550 card not too long ago and I'm not ready to give it up yet.Kingston HyperX DDR400 RAM, 1 GBWestern Digital Caviar 120GB SATA-2 hard driveI'll just use my current case since I like it and it is more than adequate. All of this stuff will set me back around $400 from Newegg. I figure this setup should last me a while. Quote Selected
Building A System Reply #1 – August 25, 2006, 10:41:29 PM Looks like a good build! I know that I purchased 2 SATA hardrives and set them up as a RAid-0 config and those cant be beat! Programs load in half the time they used to! BUt even just the SATA drive alone will be a lot faster than IDE. Looks like youve done your homework! Quote Selected
Building A System Reply #2 – August 26, 2006, 12:33:20 AM If $400 is your budget, that looks decent. Although you might want to look into going with AM2 or maybe even a new Intel Core 2 Duo system, but you probably dont feel like saving any more :hick: . Quote Selected
Building A System Reply #3 – August 27, 2006, 09:32:30 PM Quoteyou might want to look into going with AM2The motherboard I decided on has a slot that will allow an AM2 processor to be used later on if I decide to. I did a bit of reading and for what I'll be using it for I can't see a huge difference between 939 and AM2. Plus, there are no AM2 motherboards that can be used with an AGP video card. Quote Selected
Building A System Reply #4 – August 27, 2006, 11:15:59 PM You can get a PCI-E card for pretty cheap that will probably run as good (if not better) as that 9550. Quote Selected
Building A System Reply #5 – August 27, 2006, 11:43:50 PM 9550 is a total budget card, it would be a waste of the rest of that setup to use that card. Quote Selected
Building A System Reply #6 – August 28, 2006, 12:03:02 AM Quote from: bhazard9550 is a total budget card, it would be a waste of the rest of that setup to use that card.Agreed.http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813131033http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814133154Not the best, but it would be a big improvement along with that CPU you plan on getting. If you wanna save some money, just get an X2 3800+ for $159; it's plenty fast. Getting that 6600 will improve performance A LOT more than a 4200+ over a 3800+. I doubt you'll even know the difference in CPU. Quote Selected
Building A System Reply #7 – August 28, 2006, 01:24:33 PM Say whatever you want about the 9550, but it runs the games I have quite well with its 256MB of memory. Besides, I haven't had it that long and don't want to drop another $160 yet. It won't hurt me to keep it, and then when I upgrade to PCIe I will enjoy the system even more, right?But I digress. Thanks for the links to the PCIe cards. When I'm ready to get one of them six months from now, they'll be cheaper! :D Quote Selected
Building A System Reply #8 – September 09, 2006, 07:47:02 AM After looking at your choices (was allready familiar with the CPU and vid card), it seems to be an ok path. Further investigation into performance shows decent scores for the mainboard you are looking at. If it is the AM2 upgrade path you are looking at, forget it. The add in board, while it works well, is a tight fit. ( http://www.ocworkbench.com/2006/asrock/AM2%20CPU%20Board/g2.htm follow link and look at the second picture) Air flow for CPU cooling WILL be an issue and you will still have to buy DDR2 memory, which will be very close to the HSF. It is a large add-in card, and it currently costs about $50. Plus, look at all those jumpers you would have to mess with, ouch! In addition, the main power cable will go right over the top of the main CPU socket which will cause an air flow issue with either the 939 or AM2 setup. I would not touch it, period.Consider these parts:Vid Card: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814143049 ($30.00 Rebate Available!)Mainboard: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813131569 CPU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103562Memory: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820145450Hard Drive: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16822148149Total cost (with shipping) = $572.38 (before rebate) I know that this would require you to wait a little longer. However, it will be worth it!I can tell you that this setup will work for you, unless you want to go SLI. If AM2 is what you are shooting for during the next 12 months, wait and save your money untill you can get the DDR2 to go with the requisite parts. If you are dead set on staying with AGP, there are AGP variants of the NVidia 7600 and 7800 series cards on the market. You could do the followingMainboard: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813131541CPU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103562Memory: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820145450Hard Drive: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16822148149Total cost (with shipping) = $417.03As for Vid Cards, the 7600GT will spank the 9550 so hard I will hear it cry for it's mommy all the way up here in Detroit!btw, what is your current power supply?A side note: I have been researching and building game rigs for almost 7 years now. While some features may look good, they can be fairly spoogebersome to implement even if they work. Sure, the ULi (formerly ALi) chipset is good, but the AM2 upgrade board seems more of a gimmik than a really useful feature. While it might be good for mom & pop, when it comes to gaming...forget it. CPUs get really hot when gaming, especially when air flow is limited. It is unlikely you will be able to get a decent HSF on that AM2 add-in card if you were to upgrade and become plagued with heat issues. Plus, who knows what ASRocks' path is on the add-in board in regards to future AMD CPUs and memory speeds.I hope this post helps. Please feel free to contact me if you need to.My current system specs: Asus A8N32SLI-Deluxe, AMD Athlon64 X2 3800+, Thermaltake Tough Power 750 PSU, Thermaltake Big Typhoon HSF, 2 Gig Corsair XMS PC3200 (TWINX2048-3200C2PT), Creative SB-XFi, Plextor 716A DVD Bruner, 2 Segate 7200.9 SATA 2 80G in Raid 0, 1 Western Digital WD1600JS SATA 2 for backup, 1 Western Digital WD3200JD SATA1 in an eSATA enclosure for photo and PVR/video storage, ZBoard Merc keyboard, MS Trackball Explorer, Samsung SyncMaster 204B (Dual Link DVI), and finally; 2, yes two, BFG 7800GT OC in SLI with Zalman VF900-Cu HSFs. Quote Selected
Building A System Reply #9 – September 11, 2006, 12:00:06 PM Thanks for the post Greywolf. You've given me a bit to think about. That setup you listed is really nice, however, you are forgetting to add on the cost of a new power supply and a legitimate copy of Windows XP, which is going to add another $110 to your total, which would make it cost almost $700. Maybe I'll just have to save up for a bit longer in order to get all that you listed. It is more expensive but probably has better longevity. I don't know. They are an endless number of options out there and everyone has a different opinion on what is good and what is not.One thing I noticed about the motherboard you suggested is that it does not have 3.0 Gb/s SATA capability, which I think is a good thing to have versus the 1.5 Gb/s. Quote Selected
Building A System Reply #10 – September 12, 2006, 01:06:03 AM lol, forgot about the SATA 2. Probably would not notice the difference in most cases. Some of the second gen features might even reduce your performance under certain situations, although probably not anything noticable under light use. Anyway, here is a different PCIe board to consider:http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813131530It will become tougher to find SATA 2 on AGP boards, if you can find the feature at all (the boards like the ASRock you listed are exceptions)You answered my question on the power supply. One thing to keep in mind is not to go cheap here. Been there, fried that. Seriously. The quality of the PSU will have a large impact on system performance and especially on stability! In addition, it is better to have a higher rating than what you need in your current configuration. This gives you some headroom for additions to your system, such as more hard drives, higher end vid card, etc. As a general recommendation, you should get a PSU with atleast dual (2) 12V+ rails rated for atleast 24 amps total on the 12V+ rails. It should also be designed for Dual Core procs, which usually means you will have an extra 4 pin (square) connector. Stay away from the 4 pin molex to 4 pin square adaptor as you will not get a good flow of power to the CPU. For a single vid card setup, 500 to 600 watts is good. If you want to move to dual cards, things get trickier. You would need 600+ watts with 30 amps or more on the 12V+ rails depending on your setup. (info on my PSU http://www.thermaltakeusa.com/product/Power/ToughPower/W0117/w0117.asp ). The following PSUs are worth considering, especially the coolermaster (if you are willing to shell out the extra dough): PS Opt #1: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817154023PS Opt # 2: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817171009As for the OS, I did not include it as there are many variables involved depending on what version you currently have and the type of license involved. At this point in time, if you do not allready have Win2k or XP, you are going to have to move to XP and there are several options for doing it. That is why I treat hardware and the OS as seperate considerations when I research and/or recommend/suggest a build. In the end, it does fall on how much you can budget and what you are willing to pay for the hardware needed. Gaming rigs will generally be more expensive than non-gaming rigs. Sure, companies like Dell and HP offer "Gaming" PCs around the $1,000 price point, but they are "cheap" in more ways than price. Great if you are on a tight budget and do not want to build your own. Alienware and Falcon Northwest systems start at $1800.00 for specs similar to what we are discussing here. VooDoo PC ( http://www.voodoopc.com/showRoom.aspx?categoryID=1 ), known for their cutting edge and wicked rigs, have starting prices for desktop systems ranging from $2,800 up to $13,600 depending on flavor. For comparason, I have built several complete AMD/NVidia SLi rigs for friends & family in the $1600.00 to $2200.00 range. Sure, the cost we are discussing here is more than Dell's $499 special, but making that comparison would be like comparing $7000.00 in mods to your car with the cost of a Yugo.I like the satisfaction of having built and/or modified something myself (all PCs in this house are custom builds). Sure, you are more on your own if things end up fubar. However, you not only can choose what you want now, but what you want later instead of being trapped in someone else's idea of what your PC should be.as an aside; for those that are wondering what I pump my sound out with... I use the Klipsch ProMedia 4.1 system. AND YES, I have gotten imersed in the game, lost track of time and have had neighbors pounding on my door at 2am because they could not sleep due to the gun battle or light sabre fight that seems to be going on right outside their bedroom (despite the large spacing between houses in my neighborhood or solid concrete walls in South FL apartment buildings). Me Bad :grinno: Quote Selected
Building A System Reply #11 – September 12, 2006, 01:37:20 PM QuoteI like the satisfaction of having built and/or modified something myselfI totally agree with you there. I've had some time to browse and I've revised (read: completely changed) the system I'd like to get. Here is the new list:DFI LANPARTY UT nF4 Ultra-D Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 Ultra ATX AMD MotherboardBFG Tech BFGR76256GTOCE Geforce 7600GT 256MB GDDR3 PCI Express x16 Video CardHIPRO HP-P500W/TOP-500P5 ATX V2.01 500W Power SupplyAMD Athlon 64 X2 3800+ Manchester 2.0GHz Socket 939 Dual Core ProcessorCORSAIR XMS 1GB (2 x 512MB) 184-Pin DDR SDRAM DDR 400 (PC 3200) Unbuffered Dual Channel Kit System MemoryWestern Digital Caviar SE WD1200JS 120GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard DriveMicrosoft Windows XP Home With SP2B 1 PackThat whole setup will set me back $708.46 which I think is a good deal considering what I would be getting. I'm not a super hard core gamer so I think this setup would be adequate and would last me a while. Opinions? Quote Selected
Building A System Reply #12 – September 12, 2006, 05:04:00 PM build it and give it to me? I have been out of the hardware game for awhile except servers, sounds good to me, but i don't even know what is considered good anymore.been a good read for me none the less, and I love the amd/nforce combo. Quote Selected
Building A System Reply #13 – September 12, 2006, 06:45:09 PM Looks like a good setup! I have not used DFI, but I hear they are good. The rest I have used, except for the HIPRO PSU. I could not find much that specifically addressed the PSU. However, what I did find seemed ok. While it is not necessarily a good indicator of quiality, I do like that they give a good chart of the circuit capacities on the PSU. That helps in determining what it can and cannot do. It will work for your setup, so long as it works as advertised (which I hope it does!).WD hard drives tend to run on the hot side, so you may want to look at a cooler of some sort. I use a heatsink with rubber isolators that fits in a 5.25" bay. You can find them at CompUSA for around $10 a set (2 per hard drive). I also have one of these in another PC: http://www.compusa.com/products/product_info.asp?pfp=SEARCH&Ntt=cooling&N=0&Dx=mode+matchall&Nty=1&D=cooling&No=60&Ntk=All&product_code=312439&Pn=Hard_Drive_Cooler It works quite well and has temperature probes w/ display (if that intersts you). What type of case are you using? Does it have places for 80mm and/or larger fans? If you have some open 80mm fan locations, or have old 80mm fans, you might want to pickup some Cooler Master A8025-20CB-5BN-L1 fans to fill/replace. They move a decent amount of air and are quiet.Other than that, all you have to do is try to enjoy the wait. I really do believe you will like the setup! :grinno: btw, what games do you normaly play? Quote Selected
Building A System Reply #14 – September 12, 2006, 11:51:28 PM I love the ratings system on Newegg. Ratings for that PSU are very good and it looks to be a solid unit capable of providing the power I'll need.I'll be using the same case I have now. It has an 80mm fan in the side, one in the back, and spaces for others in the front, back, and top. It is pretty well ventilated now with the fans I have in it, albeit a bit too loud for my taste. I may look into getting those quieter ones you mentioned.I normally play simulation/strategy games. I'm really looking forward to the new Star Trek: Legacy game that is getting ready to be released. That's actually one of the reasons I've been considering upgrading. Plus my wife likes to play The Sims and is tired of our current (s...l....o....w) setup of a 1 GHz Athlon and 640MB of RAM. Yeah...I've allowed myself to get a bit more outdated than I would like. Quote Selected
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