Fox T-Bird/Cougar Forums  

As a "responsible moderator" I think the info should stay right here. First off, very few, if any, members of this board have the resources necessary to even do this "modification". I consider myself extremely proficient in electronics, and I, myself, would not be able to "toggle 6 TTL lines using either your PC or some other programmable device, IC3 must be removed and reprogrammed with the decimal values 57344 across the 16 memory locations." I would certainly be capable of swapping IC's, but this would be used for the exact opposite of what Jonathan Phillips is complaining about anyway - I would swap MY IC into a replacement speedo. Of course, my car has low mileage anyway.

In fact, I did just that, in spirit. My car had 47,000 miles on it when I bought it, but it had the base cluster. I swapped in a TC cluster, but the 200 km/hr speedo had almost 300,000 km showing on it. Naturally I was not about to have a speedo showing 250k more than was actually on the car, so I took the speedo apart and set the odometer to show EXACTLY the mileage on the car at the time of the swap. I will never sell this car, so I could have put any mileage I wanted on that odo, but I chose to put the correct mileage.

This exact scenario would apply to digital clusters as well. Suppose I wanted a full digital instead of base or buttstuffogue, but the only full digital cluster I could find was an eBay one with 250k miles on it? Should I not be able to swap my own IC3 chip over to get the correct mileage showing?


And as for all 0's, what if I were to decide to start marketing "reman" digital clusters, with the W2 mod (which, BTW, we can also thank Bondocougar for) and new bulbs and stuff? Of course this would require charging a "core" charge so people would send me their old clusters to be "reman'd". What if those clusters showed up with 400k miles on 'em? Imagine trying to sell a reman speedo with 400k showing on it!

Hell, if Ford were to even still offer speedos for these cars they'd come zero'd out. Yes, the "S" light in the speedo would be lit, but thanks to Bondocougar we also know how to do that. Do you think somebody restoring a '68 Shelby 500 convertible is going to insist that the NOS speedo head he found be rolled ahead to reflect the mileage on the car? Why would an '87 Sport be any different?

It all boils down to this: It is up to the individual to decide how they wish to use the information provided on this site. If people want to roll their mileage back they'll do it either by using the method shown here or by replacing the cluster altogether. We are here to share information about these cars, not to baby sit the owners (and sellers and buyers of them). You will note that the info shown here only says how to zero the odometer and/or change the mileage to reflect your own by using your own IC3 chip. If you come across a zero-mile, 20+ year old car, you should be able to tell if it's legit just by looking at it. Nobody is going to go through the trouble of rolling an odometer back to make a 150k mile $1500 car into a 50k $1700 one. If you feel so strongly against something you read on the internet that you threaten to leave the place you read it, you may as well unplug your network cable now and use your computer for solitaire, 'cuz otherwise you're in for a bumpy computer experience. The internet is a nasty place, and it's up to the individual users to protect themselves.

This isn't about whether or not a car runs good with x amount of miles, it's about making available the information necessary for some unscrupulous individuals to commit odometer fraud.  I don't think anyone here would go to such trouble, nor has that evil streak in them but nonetheless it is posted on a public forum.  I think that's the point JP is trying to make. 

However, Shawn is also right too.  By this age, the mileage has a lot less bearing on a car's value.  It's an old car no matter how you look at it.  I guess the only solution I can see so we don't have this moral dilemma anymore is for anyone wanting this information to email Joe (bondocougar) and have him send them the information privately, that is, if we really feel we're violating a lot of laws here.  This would mean a lot of extra work for Joe, but if he feels that the information he posted would be better kept private then I guess that's the only solution.  I'm all for learning new things about these car's and NO ONE in recent memory has made such momentous breakthroughs as Joe has.  He's the person we have to thank for the 85+ MPH mod.  I didn't see anyone getting up in arms about that because 'we shouldn't be driving faster than 85 anyway'.  But I dunno... just figured I would throw my 2 cents in.

I don't think this is any reason for anyone to leave the forums at all.  If you don't want to be associated with the exchange of this kind of information, delete your posts in this thread and everything.  It's not as if the feds will come and bust down all our doors and such.  I also don't think Joe should be condemned for trying to explore places of these cars that NO ONE, to my knowledge, has been brave enough to tackle, either.  Most of us accepted the fact a few years ago that the base/digital speedos had 'no user serviceable parts inside' and if you wanted to read faster than 85 mph, you simply switched to a Sport/buttstuffog/140 ($$$) speedo.

If a malicious person is bored enough to fiddle with our speedos AND has the knowledge to do what bondocougar listed...well then, they must be really frickin' bored. And a brainiac.

But the point is, right now it's NOT easy to do, and the full information to do that is NOT on this site. So I don't feel that there is much to worry about at this junction in time. The information was posted for those who are honestly and legitimately doing something about their speedo/odo readings. Besides, anything can be turned around the wrong way, especially when posted on the Internet.

That's why I suggested that the final solution would be in a file that can be e-mailed or downloaded and not posted in public view.

Your point about personal responsibility is well taken. I had my insurance policy on the convertible modified after I got the car appraised. What's funny about this is....I don't know the car's mileage...neither did the appraiser...and the insurance company doesn't know also. They both took my word for the mileage. Absolutely nothing is certified in any way, shape or form about the car's mileage. I got away with this (technically) because my particular county and state aren't that strict about such things. Then again...it's not like I'm selling the car either.

In general I've found owners of these cars to be pretty honest and responsible but I would hope that any kinds of mods like that would also be handled in the appropriate manner.

why would it even be in so many advertisp00gets and books? The mindset carries even to vehicles not in the 2007 NADA book! It's the difference between a "peach" and the pit to many people.

That prolly also why 1986 and older cars aren't in the blue books, and why an 86 5.0 cougar with air is appraised at just under $3000, and why I bought one a couple of years ago for $110. clearly, if the blue books say so, my 20 year old car with nearly 300,000 is worth three grand. I must have gotten a hell of a deal for a half dead car on its thrid transmission. if the cars were worth blue book, we would be buying them for blue book. And none of use would prolly be here. Except maybe royce.