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Topic: Updating the Bird.. (Read 2547 times) previous topic - next topic

Updating the Bird..

Been putting in a lot of work to the bird over the last year. Had a really solid winter attacking the to-do's I had been putting off. Redid headliner, new visors, completely stripped and re-did gauge cluster repairing printed circuit board shorts, modified housings for better light spread and put LED's in, also did the tach resistor mod so my converted 302 now reads accurately on the oem tach :) new steering wheel, a little bit of wire re-routing, fixed glass that fell off track and unglued from tabs all repaired now.. Still lots more.

Just acquired what I need to re-adjust the stance for this car. I have wanted to have a meatier tire in the back for a very very long time, grew tired of the non-functional "flush" look that is such a nuisance for speedbumps, ride quality, and since moving into the new house I can barely get it out of the driveway (builder deficiency, that is another topic I could vent for days about... maybe I'll make a post about it just because.)

So I finally bought some larger tires. I had been debating and still do about the wheel choice, I go back and forth between a lot of looks/options out there. 4 Lug will stay, so my options are limited. But I think having the larger tire on the rear will change the look quite a lot of the wheel so I'd like to see. I'm a super budget guy anyways, these tires are by far the best value for what you get (I rarely drive this car, only sunny days so I feel safe with a "budget" tire choice) and the springs were dirt cheap. I researched what I could about having a drop in the rear, but most of what I looked for is obsolete now. The 8599 is listed as a stock spring, but reading the specs on it kind of seems to be very similar to the obsolete M-5300-D. I think these are just taller. I figured for the price totally worth trying out.

The specs of the Moog 8599 springs taken directly from the Moog website:
Free Height 13.33"
Installed Height 9.5"
Inner Diameter 4.01"
Bar Diameter 0.59"
Spring Rate 249(lbs/inch)
Load 926 (lbs)

Moog 8599 Rear Springs $60 shipped

Energy Suspension 4.6101G (Black) rear spring isolators $30 shipped

Achilles ATR Sport 2 $154 shipped for the PAIR
275/40R18

Going in the car on Wednesday! I'm excited to have some tire sidewall give, and actual suspension travel again.. And be able to drive out of the garage fairly worry-free.. So many pro's.

302 H.O Swapped.. Bolt ons.. Tremec 3550.. 4.10's.. 18's..

Updating the Bird..

Reply #1
Sounds like some good progress.

I found some of your videos of the car. It looks super nice. I'd love to see more pictures and whatnot.
It's Gumby's fault.

Updating the Bird..

Reply #2
I ended up running 98 Mustang GT rear springs and Maximum Motorsports adjustable height rear control arms (without them the 98 GT springs were waaaay to short). It's the expensive option but I can now change the rear ride height to compensate to cargo/weight changes. So there is that option as well.

If the rear is too high with your setup you can always cut the spring a little bit to adjust it.
88 Thunderbird LX: 306, Edelbrock Performer heads, Comp 266HR cam, Edelbrock Performer RPM intake, bunch of other stuff.

Updating the Bird..

Reply #3
Quote from: thunderjet302;463022
I ended up running 98 Mustang GT rear springs and Maximum Motorsports adjustable height rear control arms (without them the 98 GT springs were waaaay to short). It's the expensive option but I can now change the rear ride height to compensate to cargo/weight changes. So there is that option as well.

If the rear is too high with your setup you can always cut the spring a little bit to adjust it.

has anyone tried these http://www.maximummotorsports.com/High-Rate-Torque-arm-Rear-Springs-pair-P1150.aspx
88 Cougar
88 T-Bird
other cars that don't apply to this forum

Updating the Bird..

Reply #4
Quote from: thunderjet302;463022
I ended up running 98 Mustang GT rear springs and Maximum Motorsports adjustable height rear control arms (without them the 98 GT springs were waaaay to short). It's the expensive option but I can now change the rear ride height to compensate to cargo/weight changes. So there is that option as well.

If the rear is too high with your setup you can always cut the spring a little bit to adjust it.

Yes! That was my second option, the more expensive route. I DO need control arms to be done upper and lower... I will be getting the adjustable ones for certain. The springs in the car right now are 2001 Mustang GT springs. The fronts sit alright but the rears are just too low. Having the adjustable rear arms would give me exactly what I need. I will go that route later on down the road when I have some more money to burn. I'm cheap and curious to see how these Moogs and the 275's turn out. I just want the car to be more functional for now lol. And yes not afraid to trim the rears when the springs have settled. I'll give update pics tomorrow after first install.

Quote from: Tbird232ci;463002
Sounds like some good progress.

I found some of your videos of the car. It looks super nice. I'd love to see more pictures and whatnot.

Oh right on! Yeah I threw up a few just of my progress. Figured someone else out there might be interested to see. I'm not planning on taking video tomorrow, It's such a straight forward job. And thanks for the compliment! The car has come a very long way. I haven't had really any chance to take the car out for some videos of it actually doing anything other than sitting and idling. Was hoping to get some footage of some burners, donuts and flybys. Not a lot of places around where I live to do that safely, and I put a permit on the car maybe twice this summer..
302 H.O Swapped.. Bolt ons.. Tremec 3550.. 4.10's.. 18's..

Updating the Bird..

Reply #5
If the wheel offset is close to stock, id think they would fit fine. I had 275/60r15 on the rear of my car on 10 holes. A bit too much at 28.1" tall and 11" wide. The were fine with an empty trunk and no fender roll. With some weight they would barely rub. With the 26" or so height, I think you would be fine.
Quote from: jcassity
I honestly dont think you could exceed the cost of a new car buy installing new *stock* parts everywhere in your coug our tbird. Its just plain impossible. You could revamp the entire drivetrain/engine/suspenstion and still come out ahead.
Hooligans! 
1988 Crown Vic wagon. 120K California car. Wifes grocery getter. (junked)
1987 Ford Thunderbird LX. 5.0. s.o., sn-95 t-5 and an f-150 clutch. Driven daily and going strong.
1986 cougar.
lilsammywasapunkrocker@yahoo.com

Updating the Bird..

Reply #6
Good news! The day was productive, AND successful. Sometimes those two words don't go together, but a good day for me. I even fixed a burned out fog lamp by knocking on it with my knuckle. Go figure. Magic..

Tires were mounted and balanced, they were able to get them done for me in a timely fashion without overcharging.. I actually rotated the tires and rims to the front that I have had on the rear of the car for quite some time. I was experiencing some good driveline vibration, removing the old wheel spacers I had solved a large portion of it but I still had some. When the job was done, I took the car for a spin and noticed right away above 50mph 80km/h that I was getting a very new shimmy shake in the steering wheel/front end. Painfully obviously unbalanced wheels in the front...! So those will be heading in for some refreshed balancing.. The driveline vibration from the rear seems to not be there anymore.. I didn't take the car up to highway speeds though so that's not ruled out entirely, but I know that the new springs raising the car has improved my pinion angle which was something else I knew may have been an issue from lowering it so much before.

Springs came out really easy, and the new ones went in not to bad. I needed to use a spring compressor because the brake line hose coming down in to the diff in the middle of the car was MAXED out.. I was scared I ripped it accidentally!! Luckily was only for a moment I stressed it and after a good visual and physical inspection was all good. I had purchased a new set but ended up re-using the spring isolators already in the car, they looked in great shape. So I will sell the ones I used to recoup some of the money back :) I didn't need to flip my quad shock at all, and my shocks were an appropriate length. All inspected and appear to be in great shape.

The 275/40R18 tires on the 9" rim fit nicely. I use a 5/16 spacer on the rears and it fills the wheel wells very nicely. They clear the quad shocks by 1-2". I would still like it to be a bit lower but with a bit more time and some more fuel in the tank it should settle down right where I want it. It matches the front very nicely now which is just what I was looking for. I wasn't sure how high the new rear springs would bring the back end up, but I'm very satisfied with them. They drove pretty nicely too, no more jarring ride.. I feel like they are actually pretty firm for a "stock" spring.. I love them. They are making me reconsider spending the extra dough for adjustable control arms because they just feel great and I think I really like the look of them. It's a very different feel in a good way, and a new look for the car that I feel is more appropriate..

So anywho! To summarize, having the meatier tire with the decently sized 18" wheel definitely helps fill out the wheel gap that I think most TBirds suffer out there. No rub on my test drive, I do have my fender rolled. I'm pretty happy with this setup so far, this could stay for a while. I'm digging the aggressive raked stance.. For anyone else considering this spring, this is what it will do for you!

Here are some pics!

Before new tires.. Very skinny, small sidewall, and the 01 GT rear springs make the car sit lower than in the front which is a sucky look.. Could not get out of driveway at this height without some pre-assembled ramps I keep.


Springs side by side comparison. New ones are Moog 8599 old ones are I was told 2001 GT springs. Green tag reads EAR XR3C 5560-EA which after a quick google search told me these are 2001 GT base model springs. The Moog springs seemed a little heavier gauge steel vs the GT springs.


New springs installed..


Workshop :)


Here is how the Achilles 275/40R18 mount on the 9" wide Cobra R replicas. I know different tire manufacturers can have very different actual mounted widths for the same rated width tire..


And after a quick spin to the watering hole! Left a couple great looking 11's out there too.. Tire tread leaves a good pattern :)





Resting back in her nest.. The car rolls in and out of the garage ramp free now. Game changing! So much less hassle. Thank goodness..
302 H.O Swapped.. Bolt ons.. Tremec 3550.. 4.10's.. 18's..

Updating the Bird..

Reply #7
Just word on the MM T/A springs, they are for a Mustang so if you thought the 2001 GT springs were low then these will drop it even further as they lower a Mustang 1 to 1-1/2".

The car looks awesome with the current stance.  If you want to get UCA's and LCA's for the rear and on a budget then you should look at the CHE units.  MM only sells the lower for our cars and their is a difference in the uppers between a Mustang and a Thunderbird/Cougar.  Funny think is a GM "A" body UCA works so search that here if you are interested but again the CHE stuff works really well.

83 351W TKO'd T-Bird on the bottle


93 331 Mustang Coupe - 368 rwhp

Updating the Bird..

Reply #8
Quote from: Aerocoupe;463071
Just word on the MM T/A springs, they are for a Mustang so if you thought the 2001 GT springs were low then these will drop it even further as they lower a Mustang 1 to 1-1/2".

The car looks awesome with the current stance.  If you want to get UCA's and LCA's for the rear and on a budget then you should look at the CHE units.  MM only sells the lower for our cars and their is a difference in the uppers between a Mustang and a Thunderbird/Cougar.  Funny think is a GM "A" body UCA works so search that here if you are interested but again the CHE stuff works really well.

I have read into that and am aware that the Mustang control arms are shorter and will pull the diff forward and off center of the wheel well. I remember someone posting pictures of the experiment with the results, hard lesson learned.. And yes I have the CHE set already bookmarked! They are priced really well and from what I read are great quality. The MM ones I'm surprised they only do the lowers and not uppers as well. I'm just debating whether I want to splurge and get the adjustables which will require me to use the Mustang springs again so I can have adjustability, or just get their upper & lower kit which is a really good package deal imo. I do really like the current stance and my pinion angle seems appropriate so I don't feel the adjustable upper and lower is necessary to spend the extra couple hundred USD (I'm Canadian so it costs me more because exchange rate..)

What do you use in yours?
302 H.O Swapped.. Bolt ons.. Tremec 3550.. 4.10's.. 18's..

Updating the Bird..

Reply #9
So up front my car has a Griggs Racing: k-member, severe duty lower control arms, and coil overs, Koni double adjustable struts, Maximum Motorsports caster/camber plates, and an ADDCO sway bar. In the rear the car has Griggs Racing: lower control arms and coil overs, Global West adjustable upper control arms that are GM "A" Body units with Bird/Cougar specific bushings, Koni double adjustable shocks, Chuck W shock adapters, and a Mustang GT sway bar.

I wish I could do a panhard bar but I'm not willing to give up the 3" tail pipes.

83 351W TKO'd T-Bird on the bottle


93 331 Mustang Coupe - 368 rwhp

Updating the Bird..

Reply #10
Maximum Motorsports does not offer upper rear control arms. Using stiffer than stock upper control arms with Maximum Motorsports lower arms makes the rear suspension too stiff. Jack from Maximum Motorsports told me to use the stock upper arms with new rubber bushings with the Maximum Motorsports lowers, and that's what I did. It works great.
88 Thunderbird LX: 306, Edelbrock Performer heads, Comp 266HR cam, Edelbrock Performer RPM intake, bunch of other stuff.

Updating the Bird..

Reply #11
Trust in Jack Hidley, that guy knows his stuff for sure.

Can you post up where you found the new bushings for the stock UCA's?  I know you had a thread on this but wasn't sure you covered where you got the bushings.  The ones that go in the "ears" on the rear end are readily available but I wondered about the ones on the body side of the UCA's.

83 351W TKO'd T-Bird on the bottle


93 331 Mustang Coupe - 368 rwhp

Updating the Bird..

Reply #12
Quote from: Aerocoupe;463095
Trust in Jack Hidley, that guy knows his stuff for sure.

Can you post up where you found the new bushings for the stock UCA's?  I know you had a thread on this but wasn't sure you covered where you got the bushings.  The ones that go in the "ears" on the rear end are readily available but I wondered about the ones on the body side of the UCA's.

Local parts guy got them. I believe they were MOOG pieces.
88 Thunderbird LX: 306, Edelbrock Performer heads, Comp 266HR cam, Edelbrock Performer RPM intake, bunch of other stuff.